Space Available on Speakers List

There are still some spaces available on tonight's speakers list for the Board meeting.

I wanted to let you know because of the concerns, districtwide, over the introduction of changes to the Transportation Standards on the agenda.

Understand - changes to Transportation Standards means changes to bus schedules AND start times.  

Now is the time to pay attention.

Comments

Po3 said…
It seems that the proposal on the agenda is not what is really on the table, specifically, that ALL MS/HS going to 7:10 drop?

If this is true, then how can the board even discuss transporation tonight when the proposal shows some MS/HS starting at 7, some at 8and some a 9.

If you want to email/speak what exactly are you supposed to say?
Basically, tell them to say no. Points to make:

- For some schools this is the 3rd change in 4 years.
- the neighborhood plan was supposed to save us money and we're in the red? That needs to be publicly explained how that could have happened.
- NO public engagement on this and that should be the non-starter for this issue for the Board. This issue affects thousands of SPS students and parents.
- ask parents for ideas to save money. Many parents here say there are many empty buses and, as Dorothy Neville has pointed out, the district doesn't revisit the schedule during the year and some buses run nearly empty all year.
Lori said…
It would make a lot of sense to actually survey parents and find out who plans to use the bus before drawing the routes, and to do as Dorothy suggests, re-evaluate usage patterns a month or two into the school year.

Send out a letter when Open Enrollment is over that says "Your child is eligible for bus service. Do you plan to use the bus - all the time; some of the time; not at all." Who knows, but perhaps a number of families would opt for the "not at all" option, allowing some routes to be shorter and more streamlined.

It's funny, but there has been only 1 day this school year that our bus arrived in the afternoon at the scheduled time. Every other day, it's about 15 minutes late. Parents have adjusted and this is just the way it is. But the day it was "on time," according to my 8-year old, a substitute driver had skipped the first stop and taken a different route to our neighborhood. I asked what happened to the kid who gets off at the first stop, and she said it didn't matter because he/she never rides the bus anyway. So if this is true, all of our kids could be home 10-15 minutes earlier if the district modified the route based on actual usage patterns. But instead, the driver makes that stop every day, even though no one gets off there. (again, caveat: this is according to a kid and I've not followed up with Transportation).
Anonymous said…
Repeat of my post on the other thread:

SPITTING MAD. I AM "SPITTING MAD":

Put my K and 2ND GRADERS on a bus at 6:20 (no more guaranteed 25 minute rides, boy that lasted what? a year as a guarantee?)to get to a school at 7:10 for school at what? 7:20?!?!?! THIS IS COMPLETE BULLSHEEEEEEET.

THIS IS UNSAFE. Last year the Board SAID they didn't want kids walkin on the streets early because of darkness/rain. Global warming change the weather and dawn patterns?

How can this even be up for a vote? They've fired? the Transportation Guy right? Has the staff whoever that is even talked to a single parent? I don't even want a study because it is so clearly beyond the incompetance before me. Just show me A SINGLE PARENT that was approached with this stupid idea of a 7:10 bus arrival.

DO NOT TELL ME FOR A MINUTE this is to save us $$$$$$$$$$$. That's what you said last year when you upended our family at the last minute with scheduling. YOU COULDN'T BE BOTHERED TO SEE IF THE STUPID 3-TIER SYSTEM WORKED. (AND IT DIDN'T.) NOW YOU WANT MY LITTLE KIDS UP AT 5:30 to CATCH A BUS THAT ISN'T EVEN ON TIME THIS YEAR? THE SAME BUS THAT DIDN'T SAVE THE DISTRICT MONEY?

And THEN you expect these kids to LEARN?!? (#$*..all they'll want is breakfast and a (@#*U@# nap.

This is YOUR problem SPS administration plus board or whoever. YOURS. DO NOT FIX YOUR INCOMPENTENCE ON THE BACK OF LITTLE KIDS.

Everytime I think SPS can't get worse, it does. OUTRAGEOUS. JUST OUTRAGEOUS. I bet 9 out of 10 affected parents have NO IDEA this is on the table. @)(#*@(#*(#&$#&$

Let me repeat that: (@#*@)(#(&@#&#

SPITTING MAD
Anonymous said…
Research on teen sleep patterns and school start times shows that early start times lead to twice the rate of late arrivals/absences. Also early starts increase visits to school nurse, school discipline issues, incomplete homework, student mental health issues, teen car accidents, and after school incidents of teen violence.

http://www.sleepfoundation.org/article/hot-topics/backgrounder-later-school-start-times

Our board members and district administrators know this, but just don't care. Their excuse for not addressing the issue is that they need to save transportation money. But they are obviously not saving money with the 3-tier start times.

I have heard teachers on curriculum night say, "Well this is my first period class, so they will not be able to cover as much material as the later classes. The kids are half asleep on the days they get here."

I wish a teacher would testify.



High School Parent
Anonymous said…
Like melanoma, this transportation problem has gone unaddressed for so long that it has now metastasized. I don’t mean that the district hasn’t tried to curb transportation costs. I mean it has never ever done a credible analysis of the problem.

For at least 5 years now there has been a new solution that impacts families as well as doesn’t move the bottom line on costs.

And then, after failure to see what works/what doesn’t, the staff and board throws another moving part at the problem and again fails to do a professional analysis of problem and solution. And the cancer spreads.

The problem is compounded by a complete and total lack of commitment to customer service. Again and again bell times and transportation changes have come with- what – 48? 72? hours of notice to families before it appears at an obscure board meeting.

Here is a direct personnel criticism. Director Martin-Morris looked our community square in the eye 3 years ago and promised leadership and deliverance from staff of a Transportation Report because our school saw the immediate and potentially worse (which is where we are right now) problem of how student learning and student safety and equitable access to programs would be impacted if a thorough analysis didn’t happen. A few months later he started avoiding us. Later he told us he wasn’t going to act on that promise.

In the past 3 years he hasn’t lifted a finger toward resolving a huge identified problem. And what of Director Carr? She of Boeing Best Practices. And what of handwringing DeBell…who never actually demands data? Has Patu digested this? Has Peaslee? Have any of them? How could this latest proposal possibly pass out of committee and onto a board agenda?

Parents at our school have worked our collective tails off for four years, with 3 different belltimes, to find a transportation solution that works not just for our families but for the district as a whole. In fact we as a parent group proposed solutions that the district adopted. The leadership came from PARENTS. No analysis or solution has ever been proactively proposed by district staff or district director, although Kay Smith-Blum did step in to guide us when asked to do so. Thoughtful input on our problem-solving also came from the now-gone transportation director, but again – staff and the board failed us by not following up with operational analysis of cost and not giving ANY notice of proposed changes.

And now, because of this year’s “crisis” staff and board want our kids on busses as early as 6:25 every morning? And no one bothered to notify the community? Does no one in this district THINK?

It is not OK to ask parents to get their kids up at 5:30 a.m. every day. It is not OK to have little kids on the streets at 6:15 in the darkness of a Dec. morning It is not OK to ask kids to do their best in school when they are arriving at 7:10.

Yes, there is a transportation cost problem. So can district leadership FINALLY do a thorough analysis of problem and solution. (Hint…a 3-page unintelligible spreadsheet is not a thorough analysis.) And could district leadership actually talk to the community?

In short, please show some leadership, customer service and operational smarts. Is that really too much to ask of this district? Because this particular cancer is Stage IV by my reckoning.

"Aghast Mom"
Joy A. said…
Dear Spitting Mad...

That was the best post ever. I feel like this all the time. Brava, I say, Brava....

It is always on the backs of the children. I too am also tired of watching the children in this District pay the price for Administration's complete incompetence....

I pray every day for the Department of Education to take over.
Po3 said…
"And now, because of this year’s “crisis” staff and board want our kids on busses as early as 6:25 every morning? And no one bothered to notify the community?"

They purposely did not notify the community or offer any community engagement as they know there is not a parent in this district who would support the 7:10 drop off.
Anonymous said…
It's pretty bad for the third tier elementary schools too. A 3:55 pick up time plus an hour ride plus another 10 minutes (since it's been at least 10 minutes late everyday this year), equals getting off the bus after 5:00pm. Wow.

Catherine
I just wrote to the Board with my concerns and said if they approve this to go to Action (vote) next Board meeting, they will get an angry mob of parents and students.

Their choice.
Anonymous said…
According to the bell times Melissa posted in the other thread, the distict has elementary school students arriving anywhere from 7:10 to 9:20 under 5 different possible start times.

That's systemic madness, it seems to me. For one thing: What of families with children attending multiple schools? I think this happens fairly often doesn't it? Thinking APP, Special Education, grandfathered old assignment system kids vs. their siblings, etc.

I agree that the earliest start time should be thrown out and other options for cost savings be explored.

-skeptical-
Anonymous said…
P.S. I know it's not the district's concern, but a 2:05 release time associated with that early start time? Holy Post-School Childcare Costs Batman!

-skeptical-
mirmac1 said…
There is NO excuse for the lack of engagement. The RFP for the new transportation contract was issued in November of last year. In it are many references to the potential for changes in service standards requiring approval by the board. Okay, that was five months ago.
Anonymous said…
The super early start time would be hard for teachers with very young children, too. Most daycares don't even open until 7:00, so the teacher would literally drop their child and run to their job.

Mary
Eric B said…
How do I find out what tier my kids' schools are? The policies don't seem to have that info.
Patrick said…
How do I find out what tier my kids' schools are? The policies don't seem to have that info.

Not to be snarky, but I don't think it's an accident that that info isn't available. Besides, it could change anytime.
Anonymous said…
Eric please know it doesn't matter what tier your school is now. District can and will change school's tier at drop of hat. In our case it meant my spouse had to quit his job 2 years ago. Yes quit his job. We'd chosen a school then they did that belltime switch.
Childcare wasn't feasible and the logistics sunk us.

'It Happened to Us'
Anonymous said…
Eric please know it doesn't matter what tier your school is now. District can and will change school's tier at drop of hat. In our case it meant my spouse had to quit his job 2 years ago. Yes quit his job. We'd chosen a school then they did that belltime switch.
Childcare wasn't feasible and the logistics sunk us.

'It Happened to Us'
Anonymous said…
"Aghast Mom" has nailed it. Every single year (at least since 2008)there has been some sort of transportation crisis/start time snafu. On a personal note, it became so stressful to my family that my kids transferred from a well-regarded all city draw option school (which we loved) to our local, walkable, well-regarded option school (which, thankfully, we also love). However, that wasn't our plan and we became so fed up by epic bus rides, back and forth start times, and general lack of communication by the district - and we just couldn't tolerate the distance from home to school on top of it all. All is well for us, thankfully, but now we might have to take our kids to school at 7 (or so) AM? And what of the kids who have to get on a bus at 6, give or take? It's completely inhumane. And as "aghast mom" outlined, these changes are not even based on data.

WHY oh why can't this district get its shiznit together? Seattle's a tough place, but it really can't be THAT hard to manage.

- ridiculously frustrated
Anonymous said…
The district used the 'improved' website as an excuse to hide or remove all sorts of past useful documentation that was posted. This information used to be posted for sure.

For lack of the explicit documents that used to be there, look at the school start times here. You can guess Tier 1,2,3 by whether you are early, mid, late time. I agree though. What's there now has seemed subject to change with no notice year by year

DistrictWatcher
Po3 said…
We need to avocate collectively and not let the tier (class) system divide us.

I have emailed the board. I also urge people to enst this information out to as many people as you know.
Po3 said…
I also urge people to send this information out to as many people as you know.

typing way too fast...
Anonymous said…
What about teachers and school personnel? Can they really keep creeping the bell times back 15+ mins each year without getting pushback from the admin who have to be there even earlier? I cant think of one group that will be happy about this - if the Bd members have kids who are affected, how can they even support this in any way..
- Baffled
suep. said…
I e-mailed the board about all this with a link to the above comments.

I think it all comes down to a simple question:

Are you going to allow the transportation department to dictate the learning schedules and family schedules of 48,000 families?
Maureen said…
I could have written Aghast Mom's post myself, but probably wouldn't have done it half as well.

Transportation is one thing the District does that is actually measurable and can be subject to real cost benefit analysis. Goodloe Johnson and now Enfield have been so busy trying to put a number on teacher quality that they couldn't be bothered to ask staff to produce a analysis that tracked the impact of changes in assignment and busing. And now once again, staff is trying to slide significant changes that directly impact students past the community at the last minute.
Eric B said…
Thanks to all, and I'm not trying to fall to the divide and conquer routine. I have a public testimony slot assigned. FYI, when I called a few minutes ago, I was #17, so there's a few more slots open.
Anonymous said…
Not an open thread day, so I interrupt this thread to note that Lynne Varner is at it again,. The comments following are amusing. They smartly take her to task.

Maybe someone could use her email or that community comment space to urge her to do something substantive for once like cover this transportation snafu. According to her, it's the micromanaging board that will kill the district and Education Reform that will save it. Looking at this latest start time issue I say to Varner: Hardly.

SavvyVoter
Anonymous said…
Is someone here willing to post their letter to the Bd? I can use it as a guide and re-word slightly and pass it on to the parents I know who manage school newsletters. ALso I'm a bit fuzzy on the specific new bell times being proposed - I see the bus arrival times but not the actual proposed new bell times for Elementary, MS, HS and the 3 tiers - can someone specify this info? Thnx.
- Hamilton and John Hay parent
Anonymous said…
Tier 1 families -- that early start time really stinks for you. I come from a tier 3 elementary school, and just wanted to make sure the district knows it is equally bad for the kids who start late and end late. Now we find out it will be worse next year. Since my childrens' after school activities start at 4:00, they already can't take the afternoon bus because it doesn't arrive until 4:20 IF it is on time. Under the new plan, it wouldn't arrive at the stop until 5:00 pm (assuming it's on time). Kids won't be able to make 4:00 after-school activities even if they don't ride the bus and get picked up! I will have to take my kids out of school early every day! What about working parents in the morning with such a late pickup time? The already late tier 3 start & end times are virtually unmanageable this year. It will only get worse next year. Also, field trips are a huge challenge for tier 3 schools - the buses are only available for about a 2 hour window for tier 3 schools before they have to go make their tier 1 rounds.
- Tier 3 parent
TechyMom said…
If they want to add a 4th tier, how about a LATER tier, say around 10:00AM, for middle and HS students?

Oh, but that might impact after school sports, you say? So make the practices before school, or make them a PE class in the last period of the day.
Anonymous said…
I'm with TechyMom,

Use the best teen learning hours for academics. Start school at 10.

If you start late enough, sports can be before school & then kids will really be awake for their first class.

High school parent
Anonymous said…
Nobody seems happy with this plan. What can we do to get the word out and truly, effectively get the Board to quash this proposal? Will it be too late to do something about this after tonight's meeting, it all seems v last-minute for a proposal that will have MAJOR impact on parents' and kids' lives next and following years. I can see where Elementary parents might be happy with their current tier, but they'll be dealing w/the brutal MS start times soon enough.
- sick of this s**t
It is NOT final after tomorrow night.

Hence, the "get the word" out to both parents and the Board now.
Anonymous said…
Tonight is the item "Introduction" so the actual vote, or "Action" is two weeks out. You have the time between now and the next meeting to inundate them with concerns.

Seattle parent
Anonymous said…
Does anyone know how many children are served by or use the busses? If it's 10K kids or more, that means if they charged a $100 annual fee to use transportation, they would save that $1M this new proposal is supposed to save. It would also help more accurately configure the transportation needs, as only pple who will really use the bus will sign up and pay. Exempt FRL, SPED, etc. I'm sure I'm missing something here but dont they charge for full-day Kindergarten? Seems this can be done....just one thought of probably many that can help separate Transp costs from driving bell times earlier and earlier every yr...

-MS parent
SP said…
Posted earlier, on the transportation section, but for clarification:

(despite what the Action plan lists) ALL HS & MS will be in Tier I which means busses will arrive at 7:10am (and most likely all middle schools & high schools will start at 7:30 am)!!!

This clarification was direct from the Board's office this morning (contact tel.given on the Action report), and confirmed with transportation. This means ALL MS & HS students will be dismissed at 2:00pm---

Aditionally, this was brought up at a high school meeting this morning, and apparently the principals have not yet been informed of these changes, despite a principal's meeting held last Tuesday! More importantly, principals have not even had the chance for input on these drastic changes and the impact on individual programs, metro schedules, etc.

Please contact the Board members about this before tonight's meeting- it needs to be tabled until time for a proper review is possible with ALL stakeholders, including families.
Anonymous said…
I'm still trying to make sense of the "survey" linked on the Board report. It shows various districts and their earliest "first bell" times, but doesn't show typical first bell times.

For Portland, for example, it shows a "first bell" of 7:00, but darn if I can find a Portland school actually starting at that time. The K-8s seem to start anywhere from 8:00 to 8:45 and K-5s anywhere from 7:50 to 8:50, 6-8s that start at 9:00, high schools at 8:15, it's just all over the place, but the 7:00 is just an anomaly.

annoyed
mirmac1 said…
Check the last board meeting minutes. The new transportation contract was approved. There is considerable discussion re: # students, # buses, types, # routes etc.
Robyn said…
SPS is balancing the budget on the backs of our kids once again. With a budget as large as SPS's, they can find $2 Million to cut elsewhere (central admin & testing for starts) to increase transportation's budget.

Just because they assign a budget number to transportation doesn't mean that number can't be adjusted upward.

As many people mentioned, I don't think it's appropriate to keep a spot for a kid on a bus or continue going to a stop if they don't commit to riding it. They could allow green cards to stops in use for kids who need it a few times a year.

This is insane. No organization that I'm aware of deals with budget issues this way.
Anonymous said…
So we spend all this money on MAP testing, but we cannot even get the kids to and from school within a decent, acceptable time range?

There are other ways to bridge the budget gap.

And a real transportation analysis needs to be done: where's the money going? What happened to the anticipated savings?

--Not a fiasco lover
Anonymous said…
Speaking of transportation, I just want to weigh in as a special Ed parent that i HATE that my special edication child's bus is cancelled, morning and afternoon, when the weather causes a delayed start time and then the buses run for all students who normally receive transportation except for sped students. They cancel both the am and pm buses. Makes it really difficult to hold down my job when I have to transport my child, the pick him up, while seeing all of the regular buses outside the school. It is crappy treatment of sped kids.

Signed Sped Parent who hates delayed start days because they remind me...we are treated differently
Anonymous said…
That should be "education!" Typing in a hurry=mistakes

Sped Parent
Anonymous said…
SPED parent. You are kidding right? Please tell me you are kidding.

How is that legal?

Also, how does this new transportation plan affect special education families? Has there been talk among yourselves? I don't see any discussion here before your comment and I now realize of course that it is another important piece.

Ed Voter
SeattleSped said…
Oh, they were and still are gunning for SpEd transport costs. That's funny becuase we are THE ONLY CLASS THAT IS MANDATED TRANSPORTATION.
Anonymous said…
Hey, you think we could convince city hall to let loose a couple of millions of the $200 million Family & Education Levy to help us with this. After all, getting even 15,000 (throwing out a number here) out of 40,0000 kids to schools timely will help with "academic achievement". We can make Peter Maier nominal charge, give A4E their 7.5% cut, plaster the Mayor's face all over the yellow buses for good PR re-election campaign and voila....

-think they'll bite?
Anonymous said…
Wonder how happy city hall will be with 20,000 teenagers having more hours of free time to hang out around the city every afternoon next year.

It might be cheaper to pay for the few buses that serve secondary schools than for the extra after school programs.

High school parent
Anonymous said…
I'd for sure pay $100 annual fee as a convenience for having my kid ride the bus at a decent hour. I feel that strongly about not having to drag my middle schooler out of bed even earlier.... ugh.

Don't throw a pox on me please ! : )

(middle school mom)
mirmac1 said…
Think they'll bite,

What?! and take away from the taxpayer-supported Burgess Largess and Mayoral Campaign fund?! Not very likely!
Anonymous said…
It is amazing to think that the yellow school bus might be slowly tranformed into a "user fee" service, whereby users pay a fee for it. So much for the state of public education. It sure says a lot.

We can afford the $100 and would pay. But I wonder about other families.

--FedMomof2
Anonymous said…
Most high school students do not take school busses but are given metro passes for public transportation or walk or find their own way to school. Why do we need three different start times for high schools?

Right now my son's high school doesn't get out until 3:00 making it nearly impossible to get to any after school activities or jobs.
Mother of Three
Steve said…
It seems a common theme these days to say things are too expensive to pay for, or we don't have the budget for it, and then to offset the costs with user fees. I have to say, once you go this direction, it is impossible to go back - the District will never again provide basic transportation. Getting kids to school is, in my opinion, a fundamental function of a school district. Doing so in the best, most cost-effective way is also the function of a school district. I suggest we *don't* pursue user fees...
Meg said…
Numerous routes have moved to community stops in the last couple of years - I would think that would substantially reduce the possible burden of "dead weight" - families who don't use transportation.
Anonymous said…
Is tonight's meeting televised? If so, what channel?
Thanks!

North End Mom
Dorothy Neville said…
North end mom. Channel 26 and streaming on the internet. Look on the sps website.
SeattleSped said…
"Getting kids to school is, in my opinion, a fundamental function of a school district."

That may be true in rural districts without choice. In a district like Seattle, where "option" students are given transportation to learn whatever their option, that no longer holds true. For SpEd students, we are often not given an option. It is "well you can either go to this failing school that has appropriate services, or go to your neighborhood school like your peers but have NO services." Is that a choice? Should we have to hump our kids to distant schools to get what is afforded under their civil rights? This can be expanded and expounded any number of ways.
Anonymous said…
I give up. Nothing on Channel 26 except for Shoreline CC ads, and I can't seem to connect to the live streaming video.

North End Mom
Anonymous said…
Ed Voter, I'm not kidding that SPED transportation gets cancelled on delayed start days. On every delayed start day, special ed transportation is cancelled. The policy is that if they don't transport kids in the a.m., the afternoon bus is also cancelled. I don't know how they get away with it but I am lucky that I still have a job after the weather we had a few months ago - I was hours late to work and had to leave hours early.

SPED parent
Josh Hayes said…
SeattleSped, I feel your pain, but it's not true that kids in option schools get transportation - they only do within the transportation zone of the "traditional" school in their neighborhood. Pinehurst/AS1 lost a lot of families from south of the Ship Canal when our transportation was curtailed. With an option school, the draw is (potentially, anyway) all-city, but transportation ain't.
SeattleSped said…
Josh, K-5 STEM students are guaranteed transportation from anywhere in West Seattle. How much does that cost? DeBell wants to spend $100K more on international schools, and make them option schools. How much would that transportation cost? It's like they're shopping on QVC but no one can tell them the $$ for that 1 carat cubic zirconium.
Unknown said…
If SPS is going to mess around with school hours then do it based on what's good for the children. Not what's most cost effective. If money is the priority then the kids are screwed. Find the darn money to run a proper bus service and send the kids to school at reasonable times. Reasonable with respect to their sleep needs, parents work schedule etc. Get your priorities straight SPS or the torches and pitchforks are coming out.

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