tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post2929093265180658548..comments2024-03-28T02:21:17.452-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: Pay for KMelissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger78125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-32919941278349746522010-11-01T02:57:52.647-07:002010-11-01T02:57:52.647-07:00So there are others like us! We can't figure ...So there are others like us! We can't figure out how it can be legal to charge for public school or how other parents are able to pay it. <br /><br />My daughter is one of three kids doing half-day at Bryant where there are five full-day classes. <br /><br />She is getting left out of a lot of the fun stuff. Even though that makes us really sad for her, she doesn't seem to be suffering. We're staying positive about all the things we can do as a family in the extra time and kinda "homeschooling" the things she's missing. That's working for now.Angelanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-87723072960774465942010-09-09T10:12:54.777-07:002010-09-09T10:12:54.777-07:00I elected to go half day with two of my kids in a ...I elected to go half day with two of my kids in a pay-for-K school. Apparently, this year, my child is the only half-timer out of 4 kindergarten classes. I find this shocking. How can people afford pay-for-K? We are a one income family and do own a home, so we are paying some serious property taxes to this region. I'm so frustrated that my child is not by default eligible to go full-day. Imagine the pressure half-timers to go full-day. I'm sure its very annoying to the teacher to accommodate a sole half-timer; I'd feel the same way. But, that's our family circumstances. Two years ago, I went half-day with my other child. He's in 2nd grade now and is on grade for all subjects. His 1st grade teacher told me she did not see a difference in him compared to all her other kids -- and did not detect that he did half-day kindergarten. So all the arguments that a half-timer will be behind all the other kids is nonsense. Its glorified babysitting. Im a stay-home mom and need not have my child for $2070 a year. I'd like to see this whole thing rectified before my other two kids become kindergarteners.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-17651740522605284922010-07-19T14:44:26.409-07:002010-07-19T14:44:26.409-07:00I'm not seeing enough about the fact that it&#...I'm not seeing enough about the fact that it's simply not legal. As always it's the middle class that get's hammered again.It is a constitutional right of my children to be offered an equal opportunity to education. Equal opportunity goes both ways. It is not just set up to protect the impoverished. My choices are either pay for something that I have already been paying over the last 22 years of hard work and paying taxes or my child get's 3 hours a day of school. It's B.S. to think that ALL of us can afford this just because we don't fit the school districts model of poor. I don't want the free lunches. I would rather those go to the children who truly need them, but seriously It's called PUBLIC education because the public has always and continues to pay for it already. Stop the madness. It is not our fault that the state cannot run their own business. I'm NOT paying and in a month and a half when they try to kick my 2 kids out I'll have ALL the paperwork ready to sue City public Schools and Superintendent<br />Dr. Goodloe-Johnson.<br />Please join me in questioning this illegal act by writing to the district, state legislature, and Goodloe herself.<br />G father of 3<br />West SeattleAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-87358192259781253872010-02-13T20:39:25.118-08:002010-02-13T20:39:25.118-08:00Thanks for the numbers Maureen.
I have recently s...Thanks for the numbers Maureen.<br /><br />I have recently started to have the concern that the mention of half day K in the Transition Plan may not be to address capacity but perhaps a way to disguise some intended teacher RIFs? <br /><br />Half day K appeared as a possibility in the Transition Plan at the eleventh hour along with the reduction of grandfathered transportation from five years to two.<br /><br />Just the fact that half day K was inserted at the last moment bothers me - something doesn't seem quite right.<br /><br />Using your example Maureen - what if a school normally has three full day K classes but that is altered for 2010 so the school offers one full day class and two half day classes? Suddenly, you have a full FTE K position to be eliminated. The norm. is to have one teacher take on two half day classes vs. one teacher per half day class. <br /><br />In that scenario there would be more operational savings than transportation savings as a full FTE K teacher at $80k would take a bigger bite out of the budget than the $52k for a yellow bus.<br /><br />Is this how sums will be siphoned from schools around the District to provide the currently undefined monies for STEM?<br /><br />I feel odd going all conspiracy theory. I just can't shake that something isn't quite right with how half day K was tossed into the Transition Plan and am trying to figure it out.StepJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11375599834945035820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-370615831119980042010-02-13T14:40:43.979-08:002010-02-13T14:40:43.979-08:00Ok, this is what I was looking for: It costs $52,...Ok, this is what I was looking for: It costs $52,000 a year to run a school bus; half of a FTE K teacher costs about $40,000. If they run even one extra bus (and remember they have to get all of the kids home within the one hour time limit)the District is losing money by pushing families to half day K.<br /><br />This doesn't necessarily apply to the schools with capacity issues--they don't really have a choice if they need seats for a certain number of kids, but for schools that are charging just to make revenue it's a losing proposition. Unless all of the kids are within the school's walk zone, they will save money in the instruction budget, but lose it on transportation.Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-22559924671024869732010-02-13T12:03:26.932-08:002010-02-13T12:03:26.932-08:00Yes they do. They offered to send a bus midday fo...Yes they do. They offered to send a bus midday for my son but I declined, as did the other few eligible families, as a diesel bus (or taxi cab) for one child is a little ridiculous, even if it's a short one.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00199045752800199947noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-88073274881042132792010-02-12T23:26:41.575-08:002010-02-12T23:26:41.575-08:00Did they ever send transportation letters with you...Did they ever send transportation letters with your assignment? I thought they didn't come until the very end of August or even the beginning of September.<br /><br />Do 1/2 day K students get transportation in the middle of the day (either home from a.m. K or to p.m. K)?Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-79570456022879647112010-02-12T23:02:51.961-08:002010-02-12T23:02:51.961-08:00Latest thing I hear (from a good source) is that t...Latest thing I hear (from a good source) is that the district isn't going to send transportation letters when you get your assignment. Oh, you can go look it up on the website but for some reason, they won't be including it in the assignment letter. That said, they are also beefing up customer service which is great but boy, are those people going to hear about it.Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-67909978257042921402010-02-12T21:51:05.503-08:002010-02-12T21:51:05.503-08:00New School (now "South Shore") is nomina...New School (now "South Shore") is nominally the Option School for the SE but only offered ONE tour--on <b>February 4th</b>--well before the beginning of Open Enrollment.Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-65757860770309909342010-02-12T21:42:16.776-08:002010-02-12T21:42:16.776-08:00"I believe MGJ's contract is not up until..."I believe MGJ's contract is not up until 2012 or 2013? As she doesn't think class sizes matter (no big deal if your kid has to sit on the radiator to attend class)"<br /><br />Yet she chose the New School for her child next year - with it's unprecidented small class size and private funding. Go figure...seattlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01231800476411684686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-66062615525582583382010-02-12T20:51:13.053-08:002010-02-12T20:51:13.053-08:00I hope you're right zb. It would be wonderful...I hope you're right zb. It would be wonderful if both MGJ and the Board had our backs. <br /><br />I would gladly be the "fool" for all of Seattle if it meant certainty and peace of mind for parents. <br /><br />wv: "twinsio" -- Twins got me into this but perhaps with the twins/multiples guarantee I have repaid?StepJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11375599834945035820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-73076817143718623032010-02-12T20:17:39.023-08:002010-02-12T20:17:39.023-08:00"Boundary changes may occur annually and with..."Boundary changes may occur annually and with it your certainty."<br /><br />I do not believe that boundary lines will be changed annually. I do believe that schools will have "overcrowding" at levels they haven't had under the old SAP. <br /><br />I think blaming this on MGJ is foolish. She was chosen by the school board to implement changes to a "neighborhood" school system.zbhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13205346985598789513noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-19417616744219979192010-02-12T19:21:21.088-08:002010-02-12T19:21:21.088-08:00Jen - the rub of all of this is we really don'...Jen - the rub of all of this is we really don't know what is about to transpire as this will be the first year of the new assignment plan. <br /><br />Any child at an entry level grade (such as K) is guaranteed a seat at a school based on their address. The new boundaries were drawn with some best guesses and some known data. But, until school starts in September they (District and us) won't know how many K kids will need to be accommodated. If they (District) thought maybe 70 kids would show but it turns out to be 150 then kachow -- your school will have nothing but half day K. What has been done in past years will not make a difference.<br /><br />As others have said...in the long-term this strategy does not make sense as there is no half day 1st grade, etc. How will all of these kids move on through the school? Perhaps the District planners are just trying to buy time to make adjustments to boundaries and have another year to figure things out? <br /><br />Latest word on the street is that the enrollment forms will not specify full or half day K - just list an option for Kindergarten. That way no promises are broken - right? You just registered for Kindergarten - not full or half day. So as our K teacher tells the kids -- "You get what you get and you don't throw a fit."<br /><br />I believe MGJ's contract is not up until 2012 or 2013? As she doesn't think class sizes matter (no big deal if your kid has to sit on the radiator to attend class), and seemingly does not care about the impact of perpetual uncertainty to students and families it is likely to be quite the turbulent ride for the next few years.<br /><br />Perhaps frequent boundary changes to keep your elementary kids perpetually assigned to separate schools? Just my jaded thought pattern – but parents please be aware that enrolling in your attendance area school does not guarantee that younger brother and/or sister will be guaranteed a place in the same school.<br /><br />Boundary changes may occur annually and with it your certainty.<br /><br />Parents – you might want to follow MGJ’s lead in enrolling your oldest elementary age child in an Option School. That might be one school type that can provide a full day K as enrollment is optional vs. guaranteed. If you get a good lottery number you are in! Plus, even if the boundaries change for your attendance area school you have almost certain entry for younger siblings to an Option school as all seats are open for enrollment and sibling is the first tie breaker. Sibling Preference lives on at Option Schools. <br /><br />But please fill out your paperwork correctly. List an Option school as your first and only choice. That way you do not give up your seat at your Attendance Area school if you don’t get into your Option School choice. Be careful parents. The playing field is neither level nor tilted in your favor.StepJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11375599834945035820noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-70242480974130912182010-02-12T16:55:25.816-08:002010-02-12T16:55:25.816-08:00Touche.Touche.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13269600382245620726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-12863474589824089892010-02-12T16:39:18.738-08:002010-02-12T16:39:18.738-08:00As amother who has for years had to awaken on scho...As amother who has for years had to awaken on school mornings at 630A-7, wake kids, make and pack lunches, make breakfast, wash the dishes, comb hair, check backpacks, and rush the kids out the door.....all by 8:30AM...I think I would have LOVED a half day afternoon K option!<br />Ahhhhh........seattlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01231800476411684686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-12233915343566482912010-02-12T13:49:57.372-08:002010-02-12T13:49:57.372-08:00Question about 1/2 day K. I live in NE Seattle, I...Question about 1/2 day K. I live in NE Seattle, I only have anecdotal information from friends who have had kindergarteners. Basically they've all said that 1/2 day kindergarten doesn't really exist (except 1 Laurelhurst class.) This is because the majority of kids enroll for full-day. The very few kids that enroll for 1/2 day miss out on so much (parties, other activities) or get behind in school work (?) that the parent then switches them to full-day near the beginning of the school year.<br /><br />Is this true? Are there statistics about enrollment for 1/2 or full-day kindergarten from the past few years.<br /><br />Is there a need for 1/2 day? Do parents ask the school for more 1/2 day classes so that their kid is with other 1/2 day kids? I can honestly say I don't know anyone with a kid in 1/2 day.<br /><br />*My opinion is that there should be more 1/2 day kids because they aren't ready to be in the classroom for a full day, but come on 2.5 hours? That is too little time. Neither option is great in my opinion. Also the whole 1/2 day afternoon kindergarten. Really? I can't think of many people that would want their kid's academic day to begin after noon. Mandate or no, my kid would never go to afternoon 1/2 day kindergarten.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13269600382245620726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-49835926454365863892010-02-12T09:33:17.295-08:002010-02-12T09:33:17.295-08:00The statistic is actually that Washington is 42 in...The statistic is actually that Washington is 42 in the nation in per pupil spending. Not sure if that is still the case, it was several years ago when the NEWS lawsuit started that the number was used as part of the arguement that the state wasn't providing the required "ample" funding for education. The state only pays for a half-day K, there is no additional money specifically for FRL elligbile or Title I schools to get full-day K, though SPS did choose to use some of its Title I money to support full-day K. <br /><br />The real issue is that the state isn't fully funding education, and should be paying for all day K. Or 6 periods of high school a day rather than 5.<br /><br />All of the debate over the math case worries me that people missed the bigger decision that came out that day. The people you should be lobbying not to appeal is the Gov and local legislators.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05454265569980202801noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-43831262663753742582010-02-11T20:07:03.739-08:002010-02-11T20:07:03.739-08:00From what I've heard, the daycare requirements...From what I've heard, the daycare requirements deal with a lot of issues that are related to sanitation for kids in diapers. I think that causing problems for after-school daycares was an unintended consequence of a law designed for preschoolers. I intend to write my representatives about this, and ask that daycares which only serve school-age kids be held to the same standard as elementary schools, not daycares babies.<br /><br />Lowell actually has diapering facilities because some of the kids in special ed need them, so once the sprinklers are in, I am hopeful that Lowell will actually meet the new standards. That said, it's silly to apply diapering rules to a school-age daycare.TechyMomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04650916001250022778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-50397233355183949232010-02-11T19:55:29.675-08:002010-02-11T19:55:29.675-08:00Regarding on-site child care. The state has new li...Regarding on-site child care. The state has new liscencing reguirements for before and after school care providers and most of the older buildings in seattle don't qualify. The distict told our principal it will cost $780,000 in building upgrades to be eligible to have on-site care. Nice to know our crppy building is good enough for SPS but not for the state! I heard Lowell ran into the same problem. There will be a major shortage of childcare options if schools can't expand.Megan Mchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08526624057081098551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-66722621308272520932010-02-11T19:50:27.350-08:002010-02-11T19:50:27.350-08:00... and while I agree with Jan on approach, I don&...... and while I agree with Jan on approach, I don't agree that the old system provided true choice. <br /><br />When my 6 year old son became a "behavior problem" and a "school hater" I felt my only guaranteed option was private school. Yes, I could have put his name on a long wait list to a school that was on the other side of town only to never get in. Fortunately, we had the means to make the choice that met our needs.GreyWatchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15177134279070087546noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-37636805526648647792010-02-11T19:45:39.178-08:002010-02-11T19:45:39.178-08:00"I guess one question I have is, why, if they..."I guess one question I have is, why, if they know they could have a problem, and they know they are expecting overflow, and they are planing for all this - WHY didn't you have to forcibly register for Kindergarten in December, after the final maps were approved, so they could have a better idea of what is going to happen?"<br /><br />Yes indeedy, a good question. If kindergarten is such a question mark, it probably would have been better for all concerned to enroll earlier so the district could start making plans sooner. (And, of course, parents can plan for what they need to do.) <br /><br />Maybe they couldn't have done it with the VAX. I don't know.<br /><br />But it could be quite the chaotic free-for-all if the district decides, say in May, that half of the NE schools (and maybe a few elsewhere) will only have half-day K. Would that cause an exodus to those schools that have room at full-day K? If you had many parents at one school who needed some kind of day-care, how could that be handled? Not on-site because with the capacity surge plan, every available space might be taken up. Maybe at a nearby church or community center? I would hope the district, because they are the ones sending this into motion, might at least take the lead.<br /><br />FYI, Seattle Metropolitan magazine is writing a story on the new SAP and its issues. I tried to help them fill in the blanks and the reporter was pretty surprised at how much seems to be up in the air even after you have a finished plan and transition plan.Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-14589317533238041832010-02-11T19:27:21.413-08:002010-02-11T19:27:21.413-08:00Thanks Jan for bringing up the Finnish study - I ...Thanks Jan for bringing up the Finnish study - I hope it continues to get press.<br /><br />Unfortunately, I think Melissa is right -- the train has left the station and the shortsighted thinking is that if kids could only be better prepared for Kindergarten all the other pieces would fall into place. <br /><br />A counter to TechyMom's point that a 6 hour day of K is a cakewalk for kids that have been in 8 or 9 hour daycare: It could be if they were spending more time on play and age appropriate activities, not to mention the fact that they must do homework when they finally do get home. <br /><br />I worry that the the push for more pre-school and kindergarten readiness programs will be a failed attempt to fix to a problem they have no idea how to address.GreyWatchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15177134279070087546noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-41343359770128626822010-02-11T18:38:21.887-08:002010-02-11T18:38:21.887-08:00Yes, there is talk of mandating that the district ...Yes, there is talk of mandating that the district makes accessable preschool available to all FRL families, and that's a good thing. However nobody can mandate that frl families take advantage of it or send their kids to it. Participation would, and should be, voluntary.<br /><br />I think this is a crucial piece in closing the achievement gap. But parents of course should be able to choose whether or not they want to take advantage of it.seattlehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01231800476411684686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-79606409464528240422010-02-11T17:21:58.143-08:002010-02-11T17:21:58.143-08:00Following up on Lynne's remarks, I think that ...Following up on Lynne's remarks, I think that it used to be the reasoning for having half-day K and full-day K -that some kids are ready and some aren't. (I personally held back one son because he had a late birthday AND was destined to be short. It worked out fine.) The half-day K had a short 2 1/2 hour morning that was a good taste of reading and colors and friends and for people who wanted more (either time or more academics) well, that was what full-day K was for. <br /><br />Now I don't know. But I think that the train has really left the station on whether it's good for kids. I'm mean now we want to mandate accessible pre-school for free/reduced lunch kids on the idea that too many kids come to school way behind others. There's another good article I have and I'll spin off a thread from it.Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-19760431249054107452010-02-11T17:15:43.246-08:002010-02-11T17:15:43.246-08:00Though I rarely disagree with Dora, I am with Anni...Though I rarely disagree with Dora, I am with Annie B on this one. Kindergarten should NOT be mandatory. If we want to make it "free" for any who want it, that is different and I will happily pay taxes to support it, but there are MANY (not just a few) kids who are disserved by being stuck in an "academically focused" kindergarten. Not only are many kids not developmentally ready to sit still and learn numbers and letters, and how to stand quietly in line, etc., etc., they ARE developmentally "ready" to be doing other things -- and we waste their time, and squander their lives trying to drill into them at 5 what they will easily (and happily) learn at 7 or 8. I concede that some kids are easily ready for kindergarten at 5 -- but not all. <br />IF we had more "choice" in schools (the way we did BEFORE the SAP), it might be possible to better "match" kids with programs -- so we would do less harm by stuffing them all into "real school" at the age of 5, where those who are not ready "learn" that they are not very good at school, and that they are "behavior problems" -- and learn to hate school and think of themselves as bad students. Children in Finland don't start "academic" school until 7, and one study found that while English children were ahead of them academically at age 6 (after "academic" kindergarten/preschool), Finnish kids were academically ahead in all areas at age 15.<br />See: The education standards of six-year-olds in England, Denmark and Finland: an international comparitive study (2003) is available from www.ofsted.gov.uk, reference HMI 1660.<br />The report highlighted the contrast in the experiences of six-year-olds under two radically different systems. In Finland and Denmark they went to pre-school, where the focus was on their social, physical, interpersonal and moral development. The outcomes of the systems were different. Six-year-olds in England were generally well ahead of those in Denmark and Finland in terms of the three Rs. However, by the age of 15, according to a international survey, Finnish children outperformed all others in reading and mathematical and scientific literacy.<br />If "fairness" demands that we make it free (it is not free in Germany or other places), so be it. But it should not be seen as "mandatory" unless we are prepared to grapple with the disconnect between "school" as it is now delivered, and the social, emotional, and academic developmental needs of small children (and not "normed" groups of them -- but of EACH small child). <br />And while I suppose it is possible to get to this result by forcing every family that doesn't want their child to enter structured school at five to apply to "homeschool," I think the current system -- where parents can send their kids if they want to, or leave their kids in preschool, or keep them at home and do playdates and informal stuff -- is far preferable.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18171991585667195445noreply@blogger.com