tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post4507424775408710054..comments2024-03-28T02:21:17.452-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: LEV's Leader Speaks Out (Mistakenly)Melissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger29125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-51924670649285562532013-03-19T09:27:01.750-07:002013-03-19T09:27:01.750-07:00When is a parent to go directly to the principal a...When is a parent to go directly to the principal and when do they talk to the teacher first? <br /><br />Sometimes you will talk to the teacher first, but other times you want to maintain some anonymity. Sometimes it's necessary to sidestep the teacher precisely because you don't want to micromanage the teacher - you might need the principal to step in and manage the situation. <br /><br />Knowing what to do in different situations would be helpful for parents. <br /><br />-tpAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-29873298410067549132013-03-18T22:39:54.745-07:002013-03-18T22:39:54.745-07:00Aki has enormous grade inflation ... I calculated ...Aki has enormous grade inflation ... I calculated it from information on school report cards. That points squarely at a principal, who pressures teachers to give higher grades than warrented. Aki has high teacher turnover and the principal sought lots of TFA teachers for the intial year of TFA placements. That may have been to curry favor with DownTown Admin.<br /><br /><br />-- Dan DempseyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-9242374407287942652013-03-18T13:09:11.070-07:002013-03-18T13:09:11.070-07:00@zb
And that training should teach the difference...@zb<br /><br />And that training should teach the difference between advocacy and micromanagement. While mostly parents are champion supporters of teachers, schools and student learning, there are those who give parent advocates a bad name. Ask the teachers how you can help. If they don't know, ask again next week or suggest a way you could help. If you have concerns about the class, have the courtesy to speak to the teacher instead of running to the principal with hearsay. <br /><br />open earsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-20114192341659996262013-03-18T12:42:18.834-07:002013-03-18T12:42:18.834-07:00I would like to see someone offer "pushy pare...I would like to see someone offer "pushy parent" training. I wonder who would be an appropriate group to design the training? Ideally, you'd want to empower parents with a standard of what they *should* expect and then train them in the tools to ask for their expectations to be met, compassionately and politely. <br /><br />Not every parent can do it -- some might be overwhelmed, too busy, scared, or dysfunctional. But, having a group of parents who are busy bodies clearly makes a difference in a school. A lot of us depend on those parents to keep things going, not just the poor. <br /><br />zbAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-380136088838923852013-03-18T08:12:19.601-07:002013-03-18T08:12:19.601-07:00I would have liked to see Chris Korsmo cast on the...I would have liked to see Chris Korsmo cast on the TV series, Friends. Picture her hanging out with Ross, Joey, and Chandler and barking at them and all the nutty hijinks that would ensue.<br /><br />-nonamenocreditAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-79935669664801862422013-03-18T08:05:22.585-07:002013-03-18T08:05:22.585-07:00Mr. Whiskers, actually there are two programs to h...Mr. Whiskers, actually there are two programs to help parents become advocates. One is via the district (although Blaine parents who went thru the training then complained at a Board meeting that their principal didn't want the program at their school) and one is via CPPS.<br /><br />I don't think advocacy is futile but I also think there is strength in numbers. <br /><br />Okay Other Side, what is "do what needs doing?" Because I didn't read that in Korsmo's op-ed. (She also didn't say her parents advocated for her.)Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-21174901774912363482013-03-18T02:14:22.279-07:002013-03-18T02:14:22.279-07:00Charlie, did I say "teachers" were awfu...Charlie, did I say "teachers" were awful at south end schools? No I did not. I said, generally speaking, working without oversight results in lower quality. And to be quite clear, I said "staff" tends to be worse. Indeed that is my experience. And, primarily, that lack of quality starts with the principal. They set the low bar of expectations, and teachers follow. Teachers who believe in more for students, generally leave. And finally, advocacy is not completely futile. For example, southend minority parent who know about the disproportionate discipline in the district, are recently able to use that to stem the tide of random and wanton discipline by simply bringing it up. But, if they don't/can't show up on behalf of their kids, or know about the issues, nothing changes. Self-monitoring is entirely within the ability of the district to ameliorate. My guess is this is the basic point Korsmo is making. Stop the excuses, do what needs doing.<br /><br />Other SideAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-73566094932801946322013-03-17T20:38:49.898-07:002013-03-17T20:38:49.898-07:00I have heard substitute teachers comparing notes a...I have heard substitute teachers comparing notes about the various schools in Seattle. There are some schools that no one wants to go back even at $140-$160 a day. You would get calls for subbing jobs as late as 9:30-10:00am because no one wanted to take those positions.<br /><br />Linh-Conoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-83574510903106906972013-03-17T20:05:01.689-07:002013-03-17T20:05:01.689-07:00Speaks the Truth - "No kid regardless will ev...Speaks the Truth - "No kid regardless will ever succeed" at Aki?! Mighty harsh words, and patently untrue, as you yourself posit: "It's not about the teacher or the kids...it's about the poverty and lack of support." Some kids at Aki don't need much support. Many teachers are good. Some students WILL succeed. Have a liite more hope.seattle citizenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16724175257161649500noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-89321550094438194422013-03-17T19:35:30.717-07:002013-03-17T19:35:30.717-07:00Other side,
You've stepped in it. You mildly s...Other side,<br />You've stepped in it. You mildly stated the obvious, that parents can positively affect change at their kids school, and whammo, you're a heretic. Fire the torches! A teacher who sees the benefits of parental meddling. I've met many and they are ALWAYS the best teachers. Parents can be a pain, but no parents is a disaster. Please don't let the knee jerks scare you off this blog, your voice is refreshing.<br /><br />EinsteinAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-24722140233086062432013-03-17T18:58:38.351-07:002013-03-17T18:58:38.351-07:00To even think that compare/contrasting Aki to Ecks...To even think that compare/contrasting Aki to Eckstein is a joke. Aki is badly run from the top down. The staff has no support from a Principal who is frankly utterly in over her head but then again most things would be. <br /><br />This is not about Teachers or even the kids it is about the extrinsic, the poverty and the lack of support.<br /><br />I have taught at both schools, I would never set foot in Aki Kurose ever again. Its a dump and no kid regardless will ever succeed there.<br /><br />- Speaks the Truth Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-66433636043729613742013-03-17T18:41:19.681-07:002013-03-17T18:41:19.681-07:00The thing about other side's comment - the cri...The thing about other side's comment - the critical role of parental oversight - is that it is utterly hypothetical. He can spout that off, and it can't be tested.<br /><br />Don Alexander makes the same point. Don said that the real benefit of having an integrated school was that the White families wouldn't stand for sub-standard teachers, capricious discipline, or poor equipment. He relied on them to agitate effectively on behalf of all the children in the school.<br /><br />I appreciate the fact that families and communities have to advocate for their children. You cannot rely on their teacher, their principal, the education director, anyone else in the system, or anyone in the broader community to advocate for your children - or any children.<br /><br />However, I do not believe that this advocacy makes the difference between Eckstein and Aki Kurose. Nor am I comfortable with the expressed (but unsupported) contention that the teachers working in southend schools don't care about southend students.<br /><br />This strikes me as an extension of the outrageous education reformer claim that teachers don't care about education - just their union benefits. I'm sorry, but who cares more about children's education than the very people who devote their lives and careers to it? In a similar fashion, who cares more about the education of students in low-income neighborhoods than the people who work at it full time? Am I supposed to believe that there is someone who cares more - but not enough to do the work? And these hidden angels care more about it than the people who actually are doing the work? Reconcile that for me, please.<br /><br />Finally, let's not forget the futility of advocacy. It's not effective. Families picketed Rainier Beach High School to have the principal removed and it didn't work. APP and Spectrum families - people whom you would expect to be very effective advocates, have not been very successful when advocating for their children's programs. Parent advocacy is no silver bullet.Charlie Mashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17173903762962067277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-29116168418180703132013-03-17T18:11:24.118-07:002013-03-17T18:11:24.118-07:00Noisy parents. The " public " in public ...Noisy parents. The " public " in public schools. Agree totally, but.. Why can't south end parents snoop around their kid's school like we do up north? Work, of course, but still. Folks have to make a little time to see what is going on and get involved. I mean seriously, not every parent works and a handful of involved parents can keep a school on their toes. Maybe we need some training on how to be a pushy parent. Any volunteers?<br /><br />Mr. WhiskersAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-49113654442864410022013-03-17T16:21:06.606-07:002013-03-17T16:21:06.606-07:00Actually, this is just sort of a variation on the ...Actually, this is just sort of a variation on the "fie, you lovers of the status-quo" argument. Booorrrrring. I am looking forward to the day when I can't read the Times drivel for free. <br /><br />BUT, I am grateful for the commenter there who suggests a fortune-cookie variation<br /> "May you be blessed with 2 boring parents." Love it!Chris S.https://www.blogger.com/profile/17016898261120819596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-10394672905235257522013-03-17T16:13:01.354-07:002013-03-17T16:13:01.354-07:00I watched the video. Chris Korsmo is the Don Quixo...I watched the video. Chris Korsmo is the Don Quixote of Seattle Education. She's tilting at windmills. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03542105149501352547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-73439389955517408652013-03-17T16:08:36.089-07:002013-03-17T16:08:36.089-07:00Korsmo's comment "So how do we amplify th...Korsmo's comment "So how do we amplify the opportunities for kids living in poverty without ignoring their circumstances?" jumped out at me. <br /><br />Isn't this the very point Charlie was making? There are differences between Aki & Eckstein besides "effective teachers?" Why does LEV limit itself to issues that DO ignore the circumstances?<br /><br />This sounds like LEV fighting for the high road. Good. They need to fight for it.<br /><br />Chris S.https://www.blogger.com/profile/17016898261120819596noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-36640748276921706922013-03-17T15:11:02.480-07:002013-03-17T15:11:02.480-07:00Here is the video of Seattle Speaks: State of Seat...Here is the video of <a href="http://www.seattlechannel.org/videos/video.asp?ID=3381101" rel="nofollow">Seattle Speaks: State of Seattle Public Schools 2/10/2011</a> sponsored by the Seattle Channel and City Club, that Melissa references. Charlie is speaking of the "swapping teachers" idea at 60:00 minutes. Korsmo starts in at 73:40<br /><br />She calls out the whole room as ignoring poor children.seattle citizenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16724175257161649500noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-47388309793163860892013-03-17T14:47:51.822-07:002013-03-17T14:47:51.822-07:00I have read this op-ed piece three times and -as y...I have read this op-ed piece three times and -as yet- can not figure out the concrete things Korsmo suggested that will make a real difference in educating children disadvantaged by poverty and other circumstances. She stated, <br /> "We start by acknowledging what these kids are going through. We show respect and empathy while providing hope and inspiration."<br /><br />Ok I get that, but respect and empathy do not fill an empty tummy. Hope and inspiration do not make up for lack of sleep the night before or the dirty clothes that are worn day after day or the lack of hot water for bathing. <br /><br />I am not sure what Chris expects from this piece. She hectors but provides no solutions. If she wants more wrap around services, she should say so -I agree with that and a longer school day and school year, yes I support that too - but say so. <br /><br />Finally, Chris seems remarkably out of touch about the realities of public schools and would rather run around with her hair on fire. Sorry Chris & LEV, we cannot ignore poverty nor can we ignore the lack of funding for public education and social services. <br /><br />NGCAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-51321305326378075722013-03-17T14:00:26.293-07:002013-03-17T14:00:26.293-07:00Principals are the largest problem. Do you really ...Principals are the largest problem. Do you really think executive directors really do much to improve quality? Really??? I'd like to see the evidence for that one! Evidently, Chris thinks she and others take that place. <br /><br />OSAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-17999115810757162112013-03-17T13:05:04.423-07:002013-03-17T13:05:04.423-07:00I note that on LEV's website, Chris states she...I note that on LEV's website, Chris states she has a double major in Education and Sociology. Elsewhere, she also says she graduated from Beloit college. The problem with this is that she graduated in 1985, when Beloit College did not have a major in education. Beloit College is a liberal arts college with a liberal arts focus. My sister attended the same school at the same time as Chris and majored in sociology. It did not offer an education major until 1996. Chris may have qualified for a teaching certificate based on her coursework, but I can't see how she was a sociology/education double major at Beloit as she claims. I think Chris needs to offer an explanation for this claim.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03542105149501352547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-79595418863864930482013-03-17T12:52:13.155-07:002013-03-17T12:52:13.155-07:00-other side,
You are absolutely correct that there...-other side,<br />You are absolutely correct that there needs to be some degree of redundancy in processes and oversight. That should already be happening. Where is the principal in your equation? Where is the executive director of the region in your equation? Where is the leadership that should be providing motivation and support to the staff? <br /><br />Oompah<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-90526264792657107722013-03-17T12:40:19.454-07:002013-03-17T12:40:19.454-07:00I'm just saying, that generally speaking, wh...I'm just saying, that generally speaking, when people work without oversight, their work suffers. The oversight in this system is the parents. The system needs another form of oversight, when that one is missing. <br /><br />-other sideAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-39809611245092895272013-03-17T11:58:14.570-07:002013-03-17T11:58:14.570-07:00-other side,
You have a great point. A point with...-other side,<br />You have a great point. A point with which many will agree. I understand you to be saying that parental involvement is critical.<br /><br />I agree. It is critical in so many ways.<br /><br />I am curious, however, about the extent of your experience working in "a southend school". You have made a leap from your individual (personal? professional? parental?) experience and broadly attacked all of the staff working in this environment. You do not clarify whether your experience is in one classroom, widespread in one school or with multiple schools.<br /><br />Your point loses traction because now you're attacking all staff as lacking quality, sinking to the lowest level, being not as good and not caring.<br /><br />Wow. <br /><br />Your leap is not credible.<br /><br />Oompah<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-16518364130384969182013-03-17T11:53:15.194-07:002013-03-17T11:53:15.194-07:00Jon-
Yes, all the data shows that poverty is the b...Jon-<br />Yes, all the data shows that poverty is the biggest factor in school achievement. However, there are many students on Free or Reduced price lunch (the criteria used to establish wether or not a student is living in "poverty." I have never read a study that tries to figure out what is different between the FRL students that do demonstrate high academic achievement and the FRL students that do not. My guess is that the biggest factor is the educational level of the parents/gaurdians. If anyone knows of any studies that look at this, I would love to see them.<br />Southend ParentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-11494286373411459752013-03-17T11:50:18.821-07:002013-03-17T11:50:18.821-07:00"He can spout that off, and it can't be t..."He can spout that off, and it can't be tested.."<br /><br />Sure it could but it hasn't. I feel sad you believe southend staff don't care about their students.Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.com