tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post8838953797294474794..comments2024-03-18T16:51:10.406-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: Tuesday Open ThreadMelissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger146125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-66075345677140528652015-03-20T19:14:21.186-07:002015-03-20T19:14:21.186-07:00Blossom,
Actually, I am a teacher, and in GenEd c...Blossom,<br /><br />Actually, I am a teacher, and in GenEd classes I do teach students who range from a 2nd grade reading level to a college reading level. And this year I do not have any support staff (I have worked with EAs in the past). <br />It's pretty silly to imply that someone with no personal knowledge of education is frequenting an education policy blog in order to create an elaborate personal backstory (that's what reddit is for!). If you disagree with what I wrote, that's completely fine (there are legitimate reasons one could disagree), but you need to outline those reasons rather than trying to simply dismiss others' experiences and opinions with pejorative statements. Back up your beliefs with evidence, not attacks.<br /><br />Cheers,<br />Parent&TeacherAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-45631281333827492052015-03-19T18:15:35.839-07:002015-03-19T18:15:35.839-07:00Here's the link:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/...Here's the link:<br /><br />http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/15/opinion/sunday/frank-bruni-how-to-survive-the-college-admissions-madness.html<br /><br />BAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-53863474956008402072015-03-19T18:03:05.005-07:002015-03-19T18:03:05.005-07:00Straw is too solid a descriptor for the bogus argu...Straw is too solid a descriptor for the bogus arguments against inclusion of HC students. <br /><br />I especially love the "teacher" who seems to have kids in every one of her classes ranging from 2nd grade reading level(presumably ELL) to college level. With no support staff either.<br /><br />That is not happening, no.<br /><br />Students are grouped and especially in HS. <br /><br />A well run school groups kids without creating bad feelings and with all kids receiving as much support as possible.<br /><br />Also the incredibly cynical comment that only students who will be able to pass the state tests with some help from the teacher get attention, is ridiculous and insulting to every teacher in the country. <br /><br />Shame on you.<br /><br />There's a great article in the NYT about getting into college. About kids form way better schools than ours and how they fare when they miss the jackpot of the Ivy League or other top schools. <br /><br />They actually do great. Go figure!<br /><br />Blossom<br /><br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-14296123395681004262015-03-19T16:15:59.065-07:002015-03-19T16:15:59.065-07:00Thanks for that additional perspective on the Fair...Thanks for that additional perspective on the Fairfax program, Old Dog. And I love that they actually use G&T teachers. Not likely here, but it would probably help tremendously.<br /><br />FYI, the 2013 program evaluation is where I had seen that the Level 3 services in elementary school were only weekly pull-outs. Maybe this has changed?<br />(http://fcps.edu/is/aap/pdfs/2013GMUReview.pdf)<br /><br />HIMSmomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-18530269750080510092015-03-19T15:56:40.396-07:002015-03-19T15:56:40.396-07:00@ Real life,
First of all, I was truly asking que...@ Real life,<br /><br />First of all, I was truly asking questions, not making a specific argument. I don't see how a single text approach would work well, but am interested in hearing more from those who think otherwise. "Accessible and rigor" was wondering about the conflict between accessibility and rigor and mentioned the gen ed setting, and I was noting that inclusion of the AL population in those considerations is also a factor. We're adopting materials for all middle schoolers, no?<br /><br />Second, you seem as skeptical as I do that a single textbook can handle full differentiation in social studies. While I agree that strong teachers can theoretically pull a variety of materials together, I'm not willing to agree that this happens much at all in reality. Like "realist" said, the materials pulled together are often inappropriate, but more frequently they just leave way too many gaps. This may be because teachers don't have time, but it may also be that they don't have access to those supplemental materials. If a one-size-fits-all text wins out, but with the idea that key supplemental texts are needed to provide the faster pacing, increased breadth and depth, and higher text complexity that are supposed to be provided in HCC, then those additional texts should be identified and adopted so that they can be purchased for teachers as needed. If the basic text isn't sufficient, the other materials need to be made available. <br /><br />Third, social studies adoption is what's on the table at the moment. I fully support and have advocated for an improved math curriculum, and will continue to do so. However, I also think it's important for kids to learn social studies and history, and we have a chance now to perhaps influence how that's done, if we're paying attention and thinking about the needs of all students. We will likely be stuck with these texts for a long time, so let's not waste this opportunity. I'm sorry if you feel I'm "continually harping on this" (I don't recall bringing it up a lot myself...), but I DO think that an effort to meet the needs of gifted kids, as well all other kids, should be part of the equation. "Accessible and rigor" asked specifically for feedback on this issue, but received little.<br /><br />In closing, I'll just add that teachers are probably more likely to follow the texts if they think they work for their classes. If we're going to spend money on an adoption, let's at least try to find the most appropriate texts for all groups--even if that means possible differences in materials.<br /><br />HIMSmomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-16100004093538402572015-03-19T15:06:16.808-07:002015-03-19T15:06:16.808-07:00A couple of things regarding Fairfax county G&...A couple of things regarding Fairfax county G&T program. <br /><br />Pull outs are more than once a week and in mx subjects. Their highest designation is Level IV 3-8 (AAP) and can be found in centers located in various schools throughout the county. Their AAP HS is Thomas Jefferson School for Science and Technology. But IB&AP are offered invarious HS just like here. And some of these HS are just as strong academically as TJSST. FCPS also offers level IV service in non AAP designated schools for those students who don't wish to leave their local school. What this means is they have G&T teachers in the local school teaching the equivalent of spectrum, APP, and staff ID students in blended classrooms. FCPS has partial language immersion programs in designated schools and arts and science magnet schools from elementary onward. <br /><br />**FCPS is HUGE with over 186,000 students. Fairfax Co. has about 1.1 million residents! The DC area has experienced major growth and the capacity issue has hit this area hard and earlier than Seattle. I visited my old schools and barely recognized them as they are now huge schools with portables. My old ES (located in what was considered not so great part of town 40+years ago, popular with new immigrants and poorer locals) is now an art and science magnet ES!<br /> No G&T either as a kid. Just a couple of AP classes in HS. Back then, SAT meant a lot so did grades for college entrance, but parents weren't all over us like today (mine certainly wouldn't be caught dead volunteering in a classroom). All of my friends had a P/T job in HS. Extra curricular stuff was nice, but unless you are going for music or sport scholarships, it didn't seem to matter as plenty got into UVA, Wm & Mary, GT, ivies, Chapel Hill, and Penn without. <br /><br />My how things have changed! Now parental blogs and FB page rule. It's a frenzy getting kids into the right program, right cohort, and right school. Then right career.... I honestly don't know if this is an educational (or social) improvement anymore.<br /><br />Old dog<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-88489979666079194752015-03-19T14:07:58.053-07:002015-03-19T14:07:58.053-07:00Strong teachers pull a variety of materials togeth...<i>Strong teachers pull a variety of materials together</i><br /><br />A core text is adopted so there can be some base coverage of content and it's hopefully fact checked, unlike random material pulled from the web. The reality is not all teachers are strong, nor do they all have the time to just pull something together. We've seen some pretty horribly inappropriate materials "pulled together" by teachers. Sometimes the teacher chosen materials are not grade appropriate content wise (not all teachers have a good filter), they are incredibly biased, or they are totally unrelated to the focus of the class. <br /><br />I am skeptical one text can serve both Gen Ed and HCC, but we'll see what materials are put out for review. <br /><br />realistAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-9908560963574988692015-03-19T13:47:49.044-07:002015-03-19T13:47:49.044-07:00@ HIMS Mom
Of course a single textbook is not goin...@ HIMS Mom<br />Of course a single textbook is not going to handle full differentiation in a social studies class. Your argument is baseless. Strong teachers pull a variety of materials together. To continually harp on whether a SS textbook is going to meet the needs of your gifted kid is wasted blog space. <br /><br />If you really want to get righteous about textbooks, at least put your efforts toward math adoption. Teachers tend to follow these texts more closely than social studies. <br /><br />Real life<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-20726248000926003242015-03-19T13:32:37.103-07:002015-03-19T13:32:37.103-07:00Adding on to Accessible & Rigor's question...Adding on to Accessible & Rigor's question about middle school social studies textbooks, how do you factor HCC into the mix? <br /><br />For example, Accessible and Rigor said: <i>So, in an 8th grade classroom, you might have a child reading at a 10th grade level and another reading at a 4th grade level.</i> <br /><br />The middle SS adoption process underway is supposed to address not only the gen ed curriculum, but also that for HCC. If you want to include 8th grade HCC kids in that mix, reading level range would probably go up to the college level, wouldn't it? Is it reasonable to expect that a single textbook will work for all ability levels, or do we need multiple adoptions? SPS staff have defended the idea that a single text could provide adequate rigor for all, but I just don't see how that would happen in practice. Would adopting supplemental texts that are at a higher level of text complexity and that support deeper levels of analysis be enough to overcome the limitations of a grade-level (or below?) primary textbook? <br /><br />HIMSmomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-33697668708452371152015-03-19T13:07:04.803-07:002015-03-19T13:07:04.803-07:00Guess we won't be looking to the state auditor...Guess we won't be looking to the state auditor to keep SPS in line for awhile. <a href="http://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/politics/federal-agents-search-state-auditors-house/" rel="nofollow">Head dude seems to be going down</a>. Can't trust SPS. Can't trust its minders. <br /><br />No trustAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-90705864459265942682015-03-19T12:43:58.704-07:002015-03-19T12:43:58.704-07:00@ enough already,
Yes, I read all the info and c...@ enough already, <br /><br />Yes, I read all the info and comments on the Fairfax model, but could never see what exactly is so great--or different--about it. In your mind, what makes that the ideal, and how is it significantly different from what we have? From what I understand, their continuum of services has 4 levels:<br /><br />Level 1 doesn't seem to be very much. <br /><br />Level 2 is essentially in-class differentiation. All teachers probably do that to some extent here, but most don't do it well (or sufficiently to meet the kids' needs). Maybe Fairfax teachers are just better at it?<br /><br />Level 3 consists of pull-outs. I read that these are weekly, but in multiple subjects. I guess that's similar to something like our "walk-to-math" or maybe a special once weekly ALO Language Arts program. <br /><br />Level 4 is a center-based component, where kids are segregated for the 4 core subjects. That sounds a lot like HCC--except that it appears a larger percentage of kids qualify for Fairfax's center-based program (17% of grades 3-8 in 2012/13).<br /><br />They DO have a program designed to get traditionally underrepresented groups into the advanced services, so that's great and we should be doing more in that area. But how are the actual advanced learning services that different, aside from the fact that it sounds like they have a curriculum? What am I missing???<br /><br />HIMSmomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-6366964750374909762015-03-19T12:30:17.918-07:002015-03-19T12:30:17.918-07:00Ironically, many families choose #6 Private School...Ironically, many families choose #6 Private School, because there are quite a few private schools in Seattle that do a good job of #3 In-Class Differentiation. How do they do that? Well, classes of 12-18 students, lots of assistants and councilors and homework clubs, long lunches and recesses, PE every day and opportunities for creative expression and success. If we would fund such a system, we could do differentiation too.2E Parentnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-25625631393609581682015-03-19T11:38:08.340-07:002015-03-19T11:38:08.340-07:00The Washington Post has mentioned Nathan Hale as a...<a href="http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/wp/2015/03/19/revolt-against-high-stakes-standardized-testing-growing-and-so-does-its-impact/" rel="nofollow">The Washington Post</a> has mentioned Nathan Hale as a leader in the test refusal movement.<br /><br />EdVoter<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-33948886676385523582015-03-19T11:23:12.592-07:002015-03-19T11:23:12.592-07:00Lynn,
Reread the continuum of services model. It ...Lynn,<br /><br />Reread the continuum of services model. It wasn't on your list of options--which aren't research based. <br /><br />It seems like you and others continue to only bring up counter-examples that are ineffective and against best practices as an attempt to make it seem like the current approach is the best of poor choices. This is a straw argument and, like the "hater" defense, no longer works here.<br /><br />The fact that SPS chose to maintain business-as-usual for the time being says way more about the typical dysfunction of the district than about best practices and ethics for public schools.<br /><br />--enough alreadyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-43387187785392894132015-03-19T11:16:00.408-07:002015-03-19T11:16:00.408-07:00I vote for option 1, as long as kids who did not g...I vote for option 1, as long as kids who did not go the APP/HCC route are able to access the advanced classes in LA, SS, and Science if they have the test scores and/or teacher recommendations to support that placement.<br /><br />Math is not an issue, since placement is already by done by ability.<br /><br />- reality checkAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-68856127720948955562015-03-19T10:39:19.554-07:002015-03-19T10:39:19.554-07:00For those interested in reviewing materials for th...For those interested in reviewing materials for the Social Studies adoption, the following dates are posted:<br /><br />Round 1<br /><b>March 27-April 15</b>: Public review and comments on submitted materials (at JSCEE)<br /><br />Round 2<br /><b>May 22 - June 12</b>: Regional public viewing of narrowed list of materials<br /><br />fyiAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-54131402734673419112015-03-19T10:35:06.318-07:002015-03-19T10:35:06.318-07:00enough already,
Plan? You give me too much credit...<b>enough already</b>,<br /><br />Plan? You give me too much credit. I don't have a plan. I merely expressed a preference.<br /><br />As for my <i>many previous posts on this topic</i>, it's one that affects my children. You too seem very interested in these issues. What's your connection? Are you teaching in Seattle Public Schools and is this an issue that affects students in your school?<br /><br />These are the options I see for highly capable kids:<br /><br />1. We can place them in self-contained classes in a school close to their homes. (This is not acceptable because other kids are more deserving of seats in those schools and because having kids in self-contained classrooms makes kids in other classes feel bad.)<br /><br />2. We can bus them to self-contained classes in schools outside of their neighborhoods. This isn't acceptable because it makes kids in the other classes feels bad, wastes money on busing (spoiled/undeserving) kids, and creates racial segregation between the programs in the school.)<br /><br />3. We can <i>cluster</i> them in general education classrooms in their attendance area schools and split the teacher's time and attention between three separate instructional levels. (Just kidding! This doesn't actually happen. Kids who are working two grade levels above don't really need to make progress every year.)<br /><br />4. We can fully integrate them into general education classes and use one curriculum for every level. (I don't understand why sitting next to a kid who always know the answer and finds nothing challenging doesn't make a kid feel bad - but apparantly this is not a problem?)<br /><br />5. We can put them in self-contained schools. (Out of sight - out of mind. As long as they're not in nice new buildings or in nice neighborhoods, this would work. If other kids can't see them, their parents feelings won't be hurt.)<br /><br />6. Private schools. <br /><br />I don't think your much hoped for changes are coming any more than mine are. The district is continuing with Option 2. (See JAMS with so few mid-range (Spectrum) students that they can't fill a classroom per grade level and the Meany/WMS split.)Lynnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-60187452737672603922015-03-19T10:17:01.916-07:002015-03-19T10:17:01.916-07:00Once again, we're in-fighting rather than figu...Once again, we're in-fighting rather than figuring out how to fight the district and state to ensure the best possible education for all students. Class sizes should be lower for EVERYONE. Arguing about whether APP has classes that are/might be a few students smaller than the GenEd classes misses the point. Our state has some of the highest class sizes in the nation*. Instead of writing a long comment about how the group you're aligned with** has it so bad, you should be emailing your legislator about why they're trying to get out of lowering class sizes for all students in the state***. <br /><br />I did want to address Accessible & Rigor's question about textbooks, because it's a legitimate question. Josh Hayes' response is the Ed School conventional wisdom, and it's not completely without merit. To a degree, you can aim to find books that contain complex content with simple language. That being said, common sense (and experience, in my case) tells us there are limitations to this approach. How can you explain a complex topic like Reconstruction if you're writing at a 2nd grade reading level? It's impossible to do in a meaningful way (I know, I read all the lower-reading-level books on Reconstruction when I was teaching an ELL support class). Even if you find a textbook at a reading level that *most* kids can access, you'll still have ELL students who can't understand it, students with a much higher reading level who aren't being challenged, Sped students who need more one-on-one help to complete the reading assignments, etc. etc. etc.<br /><br />So this brings us to the point where cmg would tell you that we need to differentiate. Well, I'm one of the teachers in my school whose lessons are used as examples of good differentiation by the administration. And I will be honest and tell you that, despite my hard work in this area, there are limits. You can take a text and scaffold it so it's accessible to lower readers. And you can find a more complex text to challenge students who need that. But to genuinely reach and challenge all students in the class, you'd need to make 155 (the number of students I teach as a Social Studies HS teacher) different assignments every day, which is absurd. Even if I were to try to narrow that down some by creating reading-level-groupings, I'd still really need to create at least 14 different versions of each assignment every single day. For each of my preps. There simply aren't enough hours in the day.<br /><br />So that's why even I (bleeding heart liberal that I am) support having different levels of instruction. Because as much as we might like to believe that "heterogeneous classrooms" can challenge all students if teachers just put in a bit of work to differentiate instruction, there are common-sense limits to that. And having students with 2nd grade and college-level reading levels in one class is one such limit. <br /><br />So what's the solution? McCleary. More money for education = smaller class sizes. We also need common-sense levels (that students can move between easily) to support and challenge every student. Those steps, which the state and district are responsible for implementing, will help ensure better education for **all students**. <br /><br />-Parent&Teacher<br /><br />*See: http://nces.ed.gov/surveys/sass/tables/sass0708_2009324_t1s_08.asp <br /><br />**For the record, I have no skin in this particular game - I'm the parent of a baby. Maybe he'll be Sped, maybe he'll be GenEd, maybe APP? All I know for sure is that, despite everything, I want him to be in SPS.<br /><br />***See:<br />http://www.theolympian.com/2015/02/13/3576397/legislature-might-send-initiative.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-70610565067935118512015-03-19T09:44:25.318-07:002015-03-19T09:44:25.318-07:00HIMS mom,
Your questioned has already been answer...HIMS mom,<br /><br />Your questioned has already been answered multiple times on this blog during this endless rehashing.<br />I recall that you are usually involved in these discussions.<br /><br />The continuum of services model, as we discussed ad nauseum a month ago or so ago, is how this would/could/should be done in SPS--and what is currently being done in school districts who use best practices.<br /><br />Look up Fairfax County on the search for a refresher answer to your question. <br /><br />--enough alreadyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-12003286881097235442015-03-19T09:26:35.410-07:002015-03-19T09:26:35.410-07:00@ an observer
Wasn't most of the uproar due t...@ an observer<br /><br />Wasn't most of the uproar due to the plans to feed Wedgwood into JAMS so APP would fit at Eckstein? The Wedgwood folks put up quite a fight over that one, and managed to get the maps changed on the sly, without even a Board amendment.<br /><br />As a result, there is a large APP/HCC cohort being bused to JAMS, and no Spectrum school feeding into JAMS.<br /><br />- reality check<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-50793424118363807552015-03-19T09:07:23.480-07:002015-03-19T09:07:23.480-07:00There's the added issue of capacity. What happ...There's the added issue of capacity. What happened when they suggested HCC be placed in Eckstein? There was an uproar, despite it being closer for more NE students than JAMS (hence, more busing). Some have an outward disdain for self-contained cohorts, yet they allow the district to use APP/HCC as a relief valve for school capacity issues. <br /><br />an observerAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-31998690710964994392015-03-19T09:00:32.550-07:002015-03-19T09:00:32.550-07:00What the district should be doing...is trying to g...<i>What the district should be doing...is trying to get as many kinds of students to stay under one roof, with every student reaching their potential.</i><br /><br />Well, John, that would be great. Do you have any feasible ideas that would make that happen though? And please don't say "differentiation," because we know that isn't working. As cmj said, "the best students are ignored because they'll pass the tests without any help."<br /><br />HIMSmomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-3280796596265877562015-03-19T08:56:12.003-07:002015-03-19T08:56:12.003-07:00@NP, I understand your point when you say you &quo...@NP, I understand your point when you say you "don't think comparing APP class size with elective class size is an appropriate comparison. It is the core academic classes for gen ed kids which, when compared to APP classes, seem large and over crowded."<br /><br />However, given that the predominant arguments put out there re: the mythical "small class sizes for APP" are that (a) they should cancel the classes if they aren't full--which they clearly do NOT do for these non-APP electives; or that (b) core APP classes aren't full--which doesn't fit with our experience, I think it's relevant information.<br /><br />However, you seem to think gen ed core classes are even fuller, is that what I understand? Are you saying there are different contractual limits to the number of students than there are for APP classes? That doesn't make any sense to me, and I have a hard time believing principals or registrars have just implemented such a policy at the school level on their own.<br /><br />HIMSmomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-59268946316675465332015-03-19T08:44:23.341-07:002015-03-19T08:44:23.341-07:00According to best practice, gifted students are sp...According to best practice, gifted students are special needs students.They could get IEP's.<br /><br />So the line for service is the rub. If way less kids were in the self-contained program and clustering was done, it would be obvious that at least some extra resources were needed. As it is now, there are oodles of merely well-prepared, above average students who are quite capable of succeeding and fully exploiting their advantages in life, without a self-contained, bus you from anywhere, very few poor kids, almost no ELL kids and under-represented numbers of non-whites- program.<br /><br />It seems somehow odd. <br /><br />What the district should be doing, maybe they are, is trying to get as many kinds of students to stay under one roof, with every student reaching their potential.<br /><br />John H.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-64803577112048032692015-03-19T07:50:18.112-07:002015-03-19T07:50:18.112-07:00Here's a recent Great Schools review of Whitti...Here's a recent Great Schools review of Whittier Elementary from a Spectrum family:<br /><br />"Whittier has outstanding demographics and a very involved parent and community base. Both of my children are in the Spectrum program at Whittier, and I never imagined I would be so pleased with a public city school. Whittier is a fine example of what city schools can be like again in good neighborhoods in the post-busing era."<br /><br />Notice the review mentions nothing about outstanding academics or children being challenged or, well anything, really except the "good neighborhood" and "outstanding demographics" in the "post-busing era" (yipee, no minorities). Clearly there ARE some people who are looking for a white, upper middle class cohort for their kids. Haters, you coming back at the student who feels IB kids are elitist by saying they were sent to that school because it has gangs didn't help. Is there a high school in Seattle that doesn't have gang rumors attached to it? If your children are in a special program within a school you might want to listen to what the people in the school who are not in the program have to say rather than putting them down. I think it's GREAT that all kids at Ingraham can take IB classes. Clearly the next step is to make sure that all kids feel welcome to try them and that there isn't a school-wide attitude that the kids who aren't getting the IB diploma are stupid. Being treated as a stupid and less capable because you are not in a special program is soul crushing to kids so the onus is on the administration at Ingraham AND the community at large to make sure that isn't happening there.<br /><br />Gen Ed MomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com