tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post1388543873869388755..comments2024-03-29T02:41:52.718-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: FYI and Updates on the Bell Time IssueMelissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger42125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-13637019744937067012009-03-09T11:03:00.000-07:002009-03-09T11:03:00.000-07:00I see now that all the K8's have been moved to the...I see now that all the K8's have been moved to the 8am start.<BR/><BR/>http://www.seattleschools.org/area/board/08-09agendas/030409agenda/transportationpresentation.pdfParentofThreehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15853045587227159562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-34178722791767557192009-03-06T13:25:00.000-08:002009-03-06T13:25:00.000-08:00Thanks Techy Mom.I understand that traditional K8s...Thanks Techy Mom.<BR/><BR/>I understand that traditional K8s can and do mandatory assignments whereas there are no mandatory assignments to alt K8s. <BR/><BR/>My now fairly esoteric question is does the non-standard start time for elementary students make these K8 also alt schools because of the non-standard or alternative instruction model. <BR/><BR/>In other words, can the district do a mandatory assignment to an 8:00 school for elementary students when the district standard is 9:15. Does this different start time make the school different enough? Probably not but this would be good to know.kelliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01322661098626555834noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-26719342896333106952009-03-06T10:07:00.000-08:002009-03-06T10:07:00.000-08:00I don't know about Blaine and Jane Addams, but the...I don't know about Blaine and Jane Addams, but there are most definately mandatory assignments to Madrona K8.TechyMomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04650916001250022778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-63954872800221758152009-03-06T08:20:00.000-08:002009-03-06T08:20:00.000-08:00I have a bell time question for all those that mig...I have a bell time question for all those that might have some insight. Can the district do forced assignments to a K8 with the 8 am start time?<BR/><BR/>For middle school, the answer would seem to be yes as that would be the same start time as other middle schools. <BR/><BR/>But for elementary, this is clearly an alt start time. Is that meaningful? <BR/><BR/>Most K8's are alts but Broadview Thompson, Blaine and the new Jane Addams are traditional. Does anyone have any insight into mandatory assignments at those schools?kelliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01322661098626555834noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-49304983059480382862009-03-05T13:28:00.001-08:002009-03-05T13:28:00.001-08:00To save money, the District took months of public ...To save money, the District took months of public testimony and multiple reconfigurations of a plan that netted a reduction of @2500 school seats.<BR/><BR/><B>The District is now proposing to impact at least 3000 elementary students</B> (figured at 10 K-8s x 2 classes apiece x 25 students per class) in <B>more</B> schools with almost <B>zero public engagement</B>.Central Momhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05411595538958030193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-12053073213276884782009-03-05T13:28:00.000-08:002009-03-05T13:28:00.000-08:00To save money, the District took months of public ...To save money, the District took months of public testimony and multiple reconfigurations of a plan that netted a reduction of @2500 school seats.<BR/><BR/><B>The District is now proposing to impact at least 3000 elementary students</B> (figured at 10 K-8s x 2 classes apiece x 25 students per class) in <B>more</B> schools with almost <B>zero public engagement</B>.Central Momhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05411595538958030193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-44815190100838379902009-03-05T09:08:00.000-08:002009-03-05T09:08:00.000-08:00Isn't there a customer service initiative in the S...Isn't there a customer service initiative in the Strategic Plan, "Excellence for All"?<BR/><BR/>And isn't the Transportation department the site of the pilot project for that new standard of customer service?<BR/><BR/>If this is the new standard of customer service that is going to be duplicated in every other department, then they aren't doing anyone any favors.Charlie Mashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17173903762962067277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-90031560958162735642009-03-05T09:03:00.000-08:002009-03-05T09:03:00.000-08:00The board members asked several questions of the s...The board members asked several questions of the staff and sup't on the bell times rationale presentation - couldn't tell whether they were honestly probing the logic or were doing it for their watching constituents (they each mentioned the amount of mail they've received on this topic) - and sadly, they didn't get much info or any decent answers out of the staff.<BR/><BR/>The new presentation materials from the meeting are <A HREF="http://www.seattleschools.org/area/board/08-09agendas/030409agenda/transportationpresentation.pdf" REL="nofollow">here</A><BR/><BR/>See additional comments under the post about the board meeting itself.momsterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10589728845018669169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-75845064116340402752009-03-05T06:43:00.000-08:002009-03-05T06:43:00.000-08:00Well, this puts Orca with it's hour bus ride out o...Well, this puts Orca with it's hour bus ride out of reach for my family. TOPS may move out of 1st place too. 8 is just too early. At least in middle and high school, you could put a disposable class first period and be late a lot. In most K classrooms, they do math and reading first thing in the morning.<BR/><BR/>Was anybody at the meeting? Did the board members seem like the were ok with this proposal?TechyMomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04650916001250022778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-85782744002254340192009-03-04T23:50:00.000-08:002009-03-04T23:50:00.000-08:00Maureen, thanks for posting the link to the presen...Maureen, thanks for posting the link to the presentation. I love how the last section is "Develop Task Force to review 1)Start Times and 2)Customer Satisfaction." Hmm. <BR/><BR/>Oh and Salmon Bay currently starts at 8:55 for the middle school and I believe at 9:00 for the elementary.h2o girlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12512408535354009657noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-57500879913017988962009-03-04T19:39:00.000-08:002009-03-04T19:39:00.000-08:00Some of us AS#1 parents are writing letters to the...Some of us AS#1 parents are writing letters to the Superintendent and Board, informing them that our children will be late for school every day of the year because, as the adult responsible for their care and wellbeing, we dont think an 8am start is appropriate for them physically or educationally/academically.... <BR/><BR/>I invite all other parents who dont want an 8am start for their elementary-aged child to do the same, and then to follow-through.... dont send your child to school for 8am.... make arrangements - car pool if necessary - to get them there for 9am or 9.10 or 9.15, whichever is the current start time...<BR/><BR/>See what happens...<BR/><BR/>I attended part of tonight's Board meeting....<BR/><BR/>I was a bit concerned that an APP parent thanked the District/Board for changing the start times for Lowell and TM back to the normal, but then went on to advocate 8am starts for elementary kids (she said young kids were physiologically ready to learn early in the morning - she hasnt met my 5 year old who has had sleep apnoea until recently and has a sleep deficit to make up, which has him sleeping most mornings until around 8am), and later starts for middle and high schoolers.<BR/><BR/>Sure wish some people wouldnt advocate for certain actions that are going to affect other people, without checking in with those other people that what they are advocating is something the other people want...<BR/><BR/>I like it when people speak for themselves! Dont make assumptions - makes an ass out of you and me!Sahilahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11610179287237833742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-47210890282573370512009-03-04T18:02:00.000-08:002009-03-04T18:02:00.000-08:00So it looks like all of the K-8s are on the early ...So it looks like all of the K-8s are on the early list now (page 7):<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://www.seattleschools.org/area/board/08-09agendas/030409agenda/transportationpresentation.pdf" REL="nofollow"> transportation presentation</A><BR/><BR/>Have other K-8s already had early start? TOPS start time has been 8:55 (Middle School) and 9:15 (K-5).Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-40399036159048904502009-03-04T07:05:00.000-08:002009-03-04T07:05:00.000-08:00I thought the reason for staggered start times (e....I thought the reason for staggered start times (e.g., one elementary starting at 8:55 and one at 9:05) was partly so as not to have all the buses cramming through the neighborhoods at the same time (which is usually around rush hour anyway, in the case of elementary buses). I had assumed they were still going to do that kind of staggering, that the 9:15 was an average, but apparently not.<BR/><BR/>Helen Schinskehschinskehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10316478950862562594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-9889670268165097682009-03-03T23:04:00.000-08:002009-03-03T23:04:00.000-08:00I'm mystified by the FAQ's characterization of tie...I'm mystified by the FAQ's characterization of tiering as if it's a radical new concept in Seattle Schools - they already do it, which is why bell times are staggered now (middle and high schools early, elementary and K-8s late).<BR/><BR/>And there are very few schools that combine for one route, e.g., Wedgwood and AE2, etc.<BR/><BR/>With respect to moving the K-8s to 8:00, I wish the district would perhaps respect our intelligence and not manufacture reasons to support an operational decision they have made simply because they need the K-8 bus riders to balance the two tiers.<BR/><BR/>Cross-district middle school athletics? Really? My experience with K-8 athletic teams is that they are largely outfielded by the comprehensive middle schools, and the kids and parents aren't really there for those activities anyway.<BR/><BR/>And I wonder what these "valuable programs and activities" that middle and high schoolers would miss if they went to school from 9:15-3:15 instead of 8-2. Aren't these programs likely there to serve students and wouldn't many if not most of them adjust their schedules as well?<BR/><BR/>I would love to see the data on this, having seen far too many situations where someone downtown proclaims things to be true and manufactures reasons to support whatever change it is they want, which the barest probing (if you can get to the data or get someone to answer a direct question) reveals to be half-baked at best.<BR/><BR/>Another predictable disappointment from your Seattle Schools...momsterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10589728845018669169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-4378025492838238262009-03-03T15:56:00.000-08:002009-03-03T15:56:00.000-08:00Actually, the ironic bit is that I suffer from sle...Actually, the ironic bit is that I suffer from sleep disorders myself. I usually sleep about four to five hours a night - but not always that much - and I snore very badly. My brother had sleep apnea that was literally life threatening. I am grimly aware of the importance of sleep to health and the dangers of sleep disorders.<BR/><BR/>Maybe it was gallows humor.Charlie Mashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17173903762962067277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-31850133466925372082009-03-03T13:37:00.000-08:002009-03-03T13:37:00.000-08:00Here's the bulk of the bell time FAQ:In genera...Here's the bulk of the bell time FAQ:<BR/><BR/>In general, K-8 schools, middle<BR/>schools and high schools would all start at 8:00 a.m.; and elementary schools would start at 9:15 a.m.<BR/><BR/>Why is Seattle Public Schools proposing changes to bell times for schools beginning in fall 2009?<BR/><BR/>Seattle Public Schools is committed to providing every student with an excellent<BR/>education. Focusing our limited resources in the classroom is essential in order to achieve this vision. A key strategy of Seattle Public Schools’ five-year strategic plan, Excellence for All, is to increase operational efficiency throughout<BR/>the District. This will reduce expenditures, improve effectiveness of programs and<BR/>systems and allow resources to be committed to the classroom and schools.<BR/><BR/>Currently, schools across the District have their own individual start times. This creates logistical challenges in transporting students. The varying start times at schools increase the amount of time students spend riding buses because routes<BR/>to different schools are combined to maximize bus usage.<BR/>Standardizing school start times will bring a number of benefits to our students and families.<BR/>• We will create consistency throughout the District.<BR/>• This will also reduce the amount of time that students spend riding school buses, particularly for elementary school students.<BR/>• The changes will provide more consistent pick-up and drop-off times.<BR/>• We will be able to streamline bus routes for increased efficiency.<BR/>• In addition, uniformity allows for the same bus driver to drive the same route consistently, creating a stronger driver/student rapport.<BR/><BR/>Seattle Public Schools is currently facing a $25 million budget gap for the 2009-<BR/>2010 school year and is implementing a number of changes to increase revenues and reduce expenditures. Increasing the operational effectiveness of<BR/>school bus routes will save $2.2 million per year.<BR/><BR/>What changes are being made?<BR/><BR/>Most secondary schools (high schools and middle schools) and K-8 schools will begin their school day at 8:00 a.m. Most elementary schools will begin their<BR/>school day on average at 9:15 a.m., including Lowell Elementary and Thurgood Marshall Elementary.<BR/><BR/>A key component of the new transportation plan is “tiering.” Tiering means that a bus may drive a secondary school route to meet the 8:00 bell time, then will<BR/>immediately drive an elementary school route to meet the 9:15 bell time. The same plan would be used for afternoon school routes.<BR/>Another change is the use of “neighborhood attendance area stops” for schools/programs that have large geographical draws. An example is the elementary school A.P.P. program which will draw students from two large areas<BR/>of the city. These schools will use the neighborhood attendance area stops, which affects a small percentage of students within the District. Students attending schools/programs that have large geographical draws will walk to their neighborhood attendance area stop and be transported to their school, with additional stops added at community partnership program locations, such as<BR/>YMCA and Boys & Girls Clubs.<BR/><BR/>Why are high schools and middle schools starting before elementary<BR/>schools start?<BR/><BR/>Our secondary-level students benefit from many partnerships with city and community afterschool programs and activities. If secondary schools were to start at the later time (9:15 a.m.) this would prevent a significant number of students from participating in those valuable programs and activities. A<BR/>transportation task force will be created later in the year to review this question.<BR/><BR/>How will standard bell times impact high school students riding Metro during peak commuter times? Is there coordination being done between Metro and SPS to accommodate the increased capacity required?<BR/><BR/>Yes, Seattle Public Schools is collaborating with Metro on these changes. Standardized bell times will enhance the ability of the SPS transportation department to provide supplemental yellow bus routes to areas with limited Metro<BR/>service.<BR/><BR/>How will these changes impact Special Education students?<BR/><BR/>Standardized bell times will allow the District to improve service for these students and to maximize special needs yellow bus resources. Buses will be<BR/>more likely to be scheduled for multiple school runs, reducing the number of taxi cab routes now required due to varying bell times.<BR/><BR/>How will the new bell times affect afterschool activities and athletics?<BR/><BR/>The time difference in this plan will not have an effect on afterschool athletics.<BR/>Due to the earlier dismissal time, K- 8 programs moving to the earlier start time will now have the enhanced ability to participate in afterschool activities similar to<BR/>those currently offered at our Middle Schools.<BR/><BR/>This FAQ will be updated as new information is available and questions arise. We will provide additional information soon on how the bell time change may impact child care for families and on the need to balance system-wide efficiency with grade level educational requirements.<BR/><BR/>Prepared by Office of Communications, Seattle Public Schools<BR/><BR/>Updated 3.2.09Central Momhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05411595538958030193noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-8521311898711068342009-03-03T12:16:00.000-08:002009-03-03T12:16:00.000-08:00I think Charlie was actually scoffing at the idea ...I think Charlie was actually scoffing at the idea of SLEEP, not the idea of a foundation!<BR/>It's beause he never sleeps, he's too busy researching, writing, and speaking about school issues.<BR/>Yea, Charlie!<BR/>I'd be happy to buy you more coffee.seattle citizenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16724175257161649500noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-27438113675333396442009-03-03T11:28:00.000-08:002009-03-03T11:28:00.000-08:00H2O Girl...Be aware also that once your child turn...H2O Girl...<BR/>Be aware also that once your child turns 13, the Federal Government no longer allows parents to take the child-care credit tax deduction. So that extra expense will be coming directly out of your pocket.<BR/><BR/>As far as the IRS is concerned, we don't need care (after-school, summers, etc.) for our 13-yr-olds. I wonder how many members of congress have latchkey young teens?SolvayGirlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12709893209963350066noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-25543330417865565332009-03-03T07:02:00.000-08:002009-03-03T07:02:00.000-08:00OOPs - meant to type"I dont care about an 8am star...OOPs - meant to type<BR/>"I dont care about an 8am start time for AS#1 K-8..."<BR/><BR/>They can assign whatever start time they like.... we will just be getting late slips every day and the district will just have to waste time and money sending me nasty little letters threatening me with nasty little consequences for failing to fall in line ....Sahilahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11610179287237833742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-48796356743179717822009-03-03T06:59:00.000-08:002009-03-03T06:59:00.000-08:00Four lawsuits against the closures (based on closu...Four lawsuits against the closures (based on closure process anomolies) have been filed and served over the past week... one each for Cooper, TT minor, AAA and a combined one on behalf of 8 signatories from AS#1, Nova, Meany and AAA... <BR/><BR/>If we all hate this 8am start time/busing decision so much, why dont we all get together and act to force it to be changed?<BR/><BR/>I dont care about an 9am start time for AS#1 K-8 - my 5 year old son will be arriving at school at whatever time we get there, based on his body clock and sleep cycle/needs... we dont get the bus now as it is, because the nearest stop is two blocks away but they wont let him get on there because there's a major arterial between us and it, and the stop we've been assigned to is 12 blocks away and I have to get the car out to take him to the pick-up anyway... so, we go in the car all the way, there and back...<BR/><BR/>In all my lifetime observing and being part of bureaucracies, I have never seen so much stupidity and incompetence as I have seen displayed in SPS District....and people put up with it, which enables it and allows it to continue!Sahilahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11610179287237833742noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-22952620074986911842009-03-03T06:36:00.000-08:002009-03-03T06:36:00.000-08:00I know that it's a matter of money, and they need ...I know that it's a matter of money, and they need to balance the two bus tiers, but a K-8 program is six years of elementary school and three years of middle school. Treating the program the same as a middle school, at the expense of the sleep, safety, and health of the youngest students in the system, is insane. And the release said "most" K-8 schools will change? Which ones? This is crucial information!<BR/><BR/>StuStuhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11769983958729170219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-76413701369019582182009-03-02T23:37:00.000-08:002009-03-02T23:37:00.000-08:00Ugh - not pleased with this at all. Currently we ...Ugh - not pleased with this at all. Currently we have the perfect situation, which I knew was too good to last - my 6th grader at Salmon Bay gets the bus at 8:20 am, across the street from where I get the Metro bus to downtown, also at 8:20 am. She gets home approx. 4:00 pm, and since soccer has been over she has an hour by herself three days a week until her father gets home at 5. (I'm home the other two days.) I do not want her home by herself for two hours - maybe I'm completely overprotective, but I can't do it. I suppose I'll be signing her up for several after school activities next year. Hopefully they won't cut those, or the activity bus that goes with them.h2o girlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12512408535354009657noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-40406979516513105882009-03-02T22:41:00.000-08:002009-03-02T22:41:00.000-08:00New info on seattle public schools website says Th...New info on seattle public schools website says Thurgood marshall and Lowell will have 915am bell time, middle schools and highschools and most(?) K-8 will start at 8amSeaGalBakerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02967999741397070609noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-51208206230514549272009-03-02T21:53:00.000-08:002009-03-02T21:53:00.000-08:00"In addition, uniformity allows for the same bus d..."In addition, uniformity allows for the same bus driver to drive the same route consistently, creating a stronger driver/student rapport."<BR/><BR/>Um, we've had 4 drivers this year thus far, how does changing the start time eliminate driver turnover? Even the board must know this is just complete B.S. Right?ParentofThreehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15853045587227159562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-30846855705451760232009-03-02T20:13:00.000-08:002009-03-02T20:13:00.000-08:00I am not convinced that the original K-8 8 am list...I am not convinced that the original K-8 8 am list will stand (and four K-8s were excepted, not three, Orca was one of them). At our (TOPS) Site Council meeting on Wed., our principal said that the time wasn't final--staff would have input, I assume that the other K-8 staffs will too.<BR/><BR/>I have to lead a tour at TOPS tomorrow, so I'm hoping our principal will know what our start time will be by then. (If it's 8:00, I'm going to have to let my 11 year old start drinking coffee, because there is no way she will be awake otherwise (an earlier bedtime will not help--she'll just sit there staring into the dark until 10:30--we've tried).<BR/><BR/>The FAQ says:<BR/><I>Standardizing school start times will bring a number of benefits to our students<BR/>and families.<BR/>• We will create consistency throughout the District.<BR/>• This will also reduce the amount of time that students spend riding school<BR/>buses, particularly for elementary school students.<BR/>• The changes will provide more consistent pick-up and drop-off times.<BR/>• We will be able to streamline bus routes for increased efficiency.<BR/>• In addition, uniformity allows for the same bus driver to drive the same<BR/>route consistently, creating a stronger driver/student rapport.<BR/></I><BR/><BR/>I just don't understand WHY or HOW standardized start times will accomplish ANY of this, except the first. What is the quote? <BR/><BR/>"<I>A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds"</I> ( Hooray for Emerson and Google!)Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.com