tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post4815192720780277309..comments2024-03-28T02:21:17.452-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: The Fate of the Mann BuildingMelissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-8886206957286795212014-07-15T22:33:47.682-07:002014-07-15T22:33:47.682-07:00Hi I have read your post this is very helpful for ...<br />Hi I have read your post this is very helpful for me. This article have awesome topics that I want.<br /><a href="http://leased-line-comparison.co.uk/colocation/" rel="nofollow">colocation leased line</a>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09615824574469653800noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-53402545677896279162013-10-12T00:49:20.571-07:002013-10-12T00:49:20.571-07:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Tasnimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16818991293353627341noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-85189207911857972952013-08-20T19:56:16.548-07:002013-08-20T19:56:16.548-07:00You all could also use one of the other spaces wit...You all could also use one of the other spaces within blocks of the Mann building that are: a) available, b) not owned by SPS, c) available, d) designated for community groups just like yours, and e) available.<br /><br />Seriously - there is the community center down the street, the vastly underutilized MLK building, and the now vacant Islamic Center, all of which are more appropriate for your group anyway. The lease on the Mann building is up, and the folk who sublet to you have moved out, the actual owners very much need that space, and there are clearly options in your neighborhood that suit your stated needs. <br /><br />There is simply no justification for illegally taking over a much needed SPS building, especially during this time of serious overcrowding. And that does not even take into account that NOVA was there for over 30 years, far, far, far longer than your group's few months as a sublet. <br /><br />RFAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-77753079864987121272013-08-19T07:17:35.002-07:002013-08-19T07:17:35.002-07:00Article in Seattle Times today: http://seattletim...Article in Seattle Times today: http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2021642343_mannoccupiedxml.html<br /><br />HPAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-66495919967102353632013-08-18T23:04:19.385-07:002013-08-18T23:04:19.385-07:00Hi Nora:
I was not stating that Nova had the powe...Hi Nora:<br /><br />I was not stating that Nova had the power in 2009 to change the district's course. However, my partner (Gretchen) was in numerous meetings with representatives from Nova where options for co-location, collaboration, and solidarity were put on the table by others and rejected by Nova. I am not naive, and realize that this would not have changed the outcome, but a gesture of support would have been more in keeping with Nova's aspirations for "social justice". <br /><br />However, all of that is water under the bridge. Nova now has an opportunity to reject the district's continued tactics of pitting communities against one another. Nova could now show solidarity with a community that is facing continued and increasing oppression. <br /><br />The mess that the district has made out of space planning is the DISTRICT'S problem. When people in power want to control others, this is what they do - create scarcity and make those at the bottom wear themselves out fighting each other so that they do not join forces against those at the top.<br /><br />I personally hope that Nova refuses to play this game and fights the real enemy rather than being the district's foil. <br />Ed Lamberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06484245701587798145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-68926013804361421032013-08-18T22:08:40.068-07:002013-08-18T22:08:40.068-07:00GMG,
Are you new to the district? There are 500 el...GMG,<br />Are you new to the district? There are 500 elementary students at Lincoln, another elementary school will be moving into the rest of the building temporarily and when they have all moved into their new buildings, we are going to place an entire high school there. <br /><br />There are no empty buildings, no extra buildings. ACIC staying in Mann is not an option. I hope the district doesn't enter into negotiations with these people. <br /><br />LynnAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-31230970078394084822013-08-18T21:16:17.390-07:002013-08-18T21:16:17.390-07:00Thinking about this from a different angle: is the...Thinking about this from a different angle: is there another district property that could house NOVA? Lincoln HS perhaps? Where else are there vacancies?<br /><br />Is there a reason from a program distribution standpoint that NOVA needs to be in the center of town?<br /><br />P.S. Not all leases permit sub-leasing. Where was SPS legal during lease negotiations? Who manages real estate for the district?<br /><br />GMGAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-18483880207434619542013-08-18T19:25:43.170-07:002013-08-18T19:25:43.170-07:00I am a white graduate from the Nova Project, spend...I am a white graduate from the Nova Project, spending two years at Nova, one at Horace Mann, the other at the old Meany building.<br /><br />The Nova Project is failing in 2013 when it builds walls between itself and communities, such as the Umoja Peace Center. It failed in 2011 when high schools across the District walked out against budget cuts, including Garfield HS across from Horace Mann. And, as Ed Lambert pointed out, Nova failed in 2009 when selfish parochial politicking won out over solidarity.<br /><br />Nova exited the Central District with a horrible expression of lack of community, it is hardly ironic then that it's coming back is also marked by that. With planned development at the major intersections of 23rd (Union, Cherry, Jackson), a returning Nova would be just another example of ongoing gentrification and loss of neighborhood connections. <br /><br />I was, and am, a proud graduate of Nova; however it is ACIC which would more fulfill the heritage of the Horace Mann building, than Nova.JMnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-76880875019994383202013-08-18T11:13:49.940-07:002013-08-18T11:13:49.940-07:00The now vacant Islamic School (which is in fact ri...The now vacant Islamic School (which is in fact right across 25th from the Mann Building, as those of us who live in the neighborhood are well aware) is available. Why the 'Africatown' folks are not interested in that solution, or talking with the folks at the former MLK school, is not clear to me; I could support working for either of those goals.<br /><br />I can't support telling the District, despite its many well-documented failings, to not move NOVA back to the neighborhood. Given the resources the District has available and the increasing demand, I don't see many reasonable options.<br /><br />But I'll also agree with those who say this could well get ugly. Omari, Wyking et al will not go quietly. And yes, they do have many very valid reasons to be upset. I just wish they could see past the anger and try to do something with some long-term potential, rather than go down in flames on this one.<br /><br />John StewartJohn Stewartnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-79639805014791598552013-08-18T08:54:16.430-07:002013-08-18T08:54:16.430-07:00Ed,
I think you misread the options Nova had in 20...Ed,<br />I think you misread the options Nova had in 2009. They were not some magic voice in the ear of the district who could have saved Meany, AAA, Summit or any other program. Nova did what it could to shine light on they incredibly misguided and harmful closures/moves. Students and staff did help organize rallies, made signs, spoke to the school board, to city council members, to journalists, to neighbors... SPS was clear, Nova moves to Meany w/ SBOC or closes. Options were not on the table. (Though it wouldn't surprise me if at the time, different groups were told different things.) <br /><br />I am in favor of returning Nova to Mann. I'm saddened, frustrated, and angered by the district's poor management of the entire situation, which exacerbates the challenges of all groups impacted by the coming move. <br /><br />I can't speak to ACIC's willingness or interest in working with Nova, but I do know that the "Work it Out" program who holds the lease on Mann were entirely uninterested in working with Nova students, or even allowing them to visit the Nova garden on graduation day. Both students and myself were told we need to "get over it and move on."<br /><br />Finally, I can't remember if it has come up on this thread, but because it is being talked about elsewhere- the now vacant Islamic School at 24th/Cherry is not big enough to house Nova (plus, it is not a district owned property).<br /><br />~nora<br />6th year Nova mom<br />20 year Horace Mann neighborAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-52587644507758205572013-08-18T04:00:47.415-07:002013-08-18T04:00:47.415-07:00It seems as though plans to redevelop at Union and...It seems as though plans to redevelop at Union and 23rd, coupled with an influx of newer non-Afican-American residents is creating a lot of tension in the Central District.<br /><br />The comments on this recent arson story on the Central District News site weave a story of a culture clash and a lot if discomfort<br /><br /><a href="http://www.centraldistrictnews.com/2013/08/more-updates-on-the-med-mix-fire-story/" rel="nofollow">Updates on the MedMix Fire Story</a><br /><br />GMGAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-87017334657006050832013-08-17T23:06:37.836-07:002013-08-17T23:06:37.836-07:00Census data reveals a changing Central District (2...<a href="http://www.centraldistrictnews.com/2011/03/census-data-reveals-a-changing-central-district/" rel="nofollow">Census data reveals a changing Central District</a> (2011, Central District News)<br /><br />GMGAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-43370059614544287562013-08-17T23:05:38.343-07:002013-08-17T23:05:38.343-07:00Lynn:
Yes, I believe that the system is so incompe...<br />Lynn:<br />Yes, I believe that the system is so incompetent and structurally oppressive that I do not have respect for the legitimacy of its authority.<br /><br />We have all seen this system talk from both sides of its mouth, change the rules to its own benefit, and never actually take accountability for its own errors. (How many board members of administrators resigned for their handling of the school closures).<br /><br />You can choose to have respect for their arbitrary power. I do not.<br /><br />My use of 'repatriation' is probably not entirely precise, but I certainly do not mean theft. I mean an explicit attempt to re-balance economic and social power. <br /><br />Ed Lamberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06484245701587798145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-87874164225551349772013-08-17T22:39:23.298-07:002013-08-17T22:39:23.298-07:00Ed Lambert,
You doubt the legitimacy of the distr...Ed Lambert,<br /><br />You doubt the legitimacy of the district's authority over the Mann building? They own it. They don't need to permission of the neighborhood to use it. <br /><br />Is repatriation another word for theft? <br /><br />Lynn<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-54861683730827437462013-08-17T22:34:19.575-07:002013-08-17T22:34:19.575-07:00Charlie:
I actually don't think this is a par...Charlie: <br />I actually don't think this is a particularly 'high' standard - if you don't think people should be kicked to the curb, don't kick people to the curb.<br /><br />Principles like this are important. I could go back and forth on fine points of the numerous other options that were available to Nova in 2009, my opinions on why Rainier Beach is half empty, and my personal thoughts on who I think should go where.<br /><br />However, I think that misses the point. My point is: we live in a system of grave systemic injustice. The culture in our city generally ignores the white supremacist social structures that maintain boundaries of power, freedom and economic control. <br /><br />My point is that maybe white dudes like you and me should take a back seat and let the community decide what THEY think should happen.Ed Lamberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06484245701587798145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-59955480055941799252013-08-17T17:30:54.589-07:002013-08-17T17:30:54.589-07:00Ed, I guess the NOVA community should be proud tha...Ed, I guess the NOVA community should be proud that you hold them to a higher standard than any other community in the District.<br /><br />NOVA could not offer to merge with Summit K-12 or Meany in 2009 because the Mann building couldn't hold all of those students.<br /><br />If you think that the ACIC is deserving of some public space, there is plenty to choose from other than the Mann Building. Why the Mann Building? And why must the school district be the institution to sacrifice their asset instead of the City, the County, or any other public or private institution?<br /><br />Half of Rainier Beach High School is empty.<br /><br />The building at Van Asselt is under-utilized.<br /><br />The community center at the MLK school - you know, the one that the District sold at a significant discount from full market value so it could provide space for the African-American community in the Central District - has space for ACIC. Surely that is precisely the sort of concession that you're looking for, isn't it?Charlie Mashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17173903762962067277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-19233816043747941302013-08-17T13:39:04.108-07:002013-08-17T13:39:04.108-07:00@seattle citizen,
Minor correction, Garfield Comm...@seattle citizen,<br /><br />Minor correction, Garfield Community Center sits on Parks property, not the District's. Although minor, I don't want people thinking the District can just go wrestle that building back if they felt like it.<br /><br />--Fremont DadAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-58283615150589473562013-08-17T13:30:22.477-07:002013-08-17T13:30:22.477-07:00Seattle Citizen:
I recognize that individuals from...Seattle Citizen:<br />I recognize that individuals from the Nova community (like Charlie) were against the ill-advised closures.<br /><br />However, my point is that as a COMMUNITY Nova did not show solidarity with the larger community. I think that is a bad thing and expect more from humanity.<br /><br />I hope that the students will consider the issues facing the wider community, rather than be the willing foil for yet another series of clumsy moves from the district.<br /><br /><br />Ed Lamberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06484245701587798145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-31665255012369265152013-08-17T13:11:46.909-07:002013-08-17T13:11:46.909-07:00Ed Lambert writes, "Nova had opportunities to...Ed Lambert writes, "Nova had opportunities to stand up for schools like Meany (the building Nova now occupies), the African American Academy, Summit K-12, and others and they did not."<br /><br />I'd just point out here that Charlie Mas (Nova parent and supporter; district-wide student supporter) supported the John Marshall school as the district moved to close that school. He attended meetings with district and spoke eloquently on behalf of the students and programs.<br /><br />So it's not quite true that Nova didn't support other schools. Some in its community certainly did, individually and/or as part of the Alternative School Coalition and the district's Alternative School Committee.seattle citizenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16724175257161649500noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-80995534496989340522013-08-17T12:54:52.067-07:002013-08-17T12:54:52.067-07:00(PART 2 of 2 - Continued from last post)
I have ...(PART 2 of 2 - Continued from last post)<br /><br /><br />I have been disappointed that this type of on-the-ground social empathy and solidarity has not been more ingrained in the school culture at Nova. I have heard at least one teacher and a handful of students and parents recently voice concerns that Nova is not doing enough to address the needs of ALL students in the district. <br /><br /><br />It would be fantastic if Nova students reached out to the ACIC to learn the value of what the ACIC is creating. The principle of community-empowered and self-directed education that Nova espouses is what ACIC is DOING! The repatriation of public space to the African American community is the embodiment of of the “social justice” that Nova claims to pursue. <br /><br /><br />I personally would hope Nova students could see this value and create an internal movement to show solidarity with the ACIC and try to stop or alter the move of Nova to Mann. <br /><br />No one reading this article can deny that the district has demonstrated sheer incompetence in managing school capacity and a callous disregard for the needs of communities of color. The Nova community and other communities in the city should be standing with the ACIC to de-legitimize district authority and fight the social and educational structures that funnel all of our young people into the role of either the oppressor or the oppressed. <br />Ed Lamberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06484245701587798145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-87042302568864322782013-08-17T12:54:08.425-07:002013-08-17T12:54:08.425-07:00As a parent of a recent Nova graduate and a return...As a parent of a recent Nova graduate and a returning Nova student, this is a critical issue that strongly resonates with me.<br /><br /><br />Personally, I respect and completely support the self-directed actions of the ACIC community to create a model for education and engagement that works for young people of color in the Central Area. (The current Seattle School district practices and the larger culture as a whole are clearly NOT working for young people of color.) <br /><br /><br />I personally support the ACIC remaining at the Mann building because it is critical for communities to reclaim common spaces in the face of an increasing economic marginalization (economic violence) that has pushed poor communities out of the way to make room for white-condo-rei-disneyland Seattle. <br /><br /><br />Given the behavior of the district and their lack of accountability over the botched 2009 school closure and a long succession of fumbles, I have zero belief in the legitimacy of their authority over what happens to the Mann building. They change rules at their whim because that is what power structures do. (Charlie, you of all people have seen that first hand. Stating that everyone should "respect their authority" as if you believe the district is always right seems disingenuous to me.)<br /><br /><br />My family chose Nova because we believed that the model of horizontal, democratic decision making would allow students to work on social issues in a way that is deep, authentic, and addresses the real conditions of their community. We felt this would be a positive contrast to the hollow and abstract self-declarations of "social justice" that we have all hear preached, but rarely see put into practice.<br /><br /><br />However, I believe that the Nova community has become negatively conditioned by a 'siege' mentality. For 30 years, they have fought near constant threats of closure and hostility from the district for refusing to follow top-down mandates and listen to the needs of their students. Unfortunately, the cost of this 'siege mentality' is high, and may be partially responsible for the extreme lack of solidarity with other communities that I have seen Nova exhibit in recent years. <br /><br /><br />For example, during the brutal 2009 closures, schools were clearly pitted against each other by the district. One community had to lose for another to win. Schools came to district HQ begging the district overlords to "close THAT OTHER school - not ours!!". Nova had opportunities to stand up for schools like Meany (the building Nova now occupies), the African American Academy, Summit K-12, and others and they did not. (In fact, Nova refused to consider merging with Meany, AS#1, or Summit - all of which would have given it the middle school that they now want to add!)<br /><br /><br />At a recent district meeting, students from the Center School gave impassioned testimony to try to prevent one of their teachers from being transferred for teaching an Anti-racism curriculum. Nova students also appeared, but testified about recycling, without mentioning (or even seeming to notice) that there were real people 20 feet away from them that needed support. Just a passing shout out would have shown humanity and helped create solidarity. <br />Ed Lamberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06484245701587798145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-21981612841785082612013-08-17T09:22:16.485-07:002013-08-17T09:22:16.485-07:00The claim from the ACIC folks has no merit. None.
...The claim from the ACIC folks has no merit. None.<br /><br />Much of what they say is simply false. Even the elements of their argument that are true simply are not relevant to the Mann Building or even their programs.<br /><br />Have African-Americans been poorly served by institutions in general and Seattle Public Schools in particular? Yes. But that doesn't mean that this group should get the Mann Building. It has nothing to do with this.<br /><br />If they really just want space for their programs, they have lots of options other than the Mann building.<br /><br />If they want to do something about access to programs, this is not the right battleground.<br /><br />If they want to do something about discipline rates, this is not the right battleground.<br /><br />Yes, Omari and his group were robbed of the Coleman building. That's absolutely true. But that doesn't mean that his current group gets the Mann Building.<br /><br />Is the Central Area a historically black neighborhood? Yes it is. Which is why there are already so many institutions in the neighborhood that historically and currently serve a predominantly black community. They don't need the Mann Building.<br /><br />The School District does need the Mann Building and they need it to house the program that has been there for most of the last thirty-five years.Charlie Mashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17173903762962067277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-8741866753323426422013-08-16T23:27:27.505-07:002013-08-16T23:27:27.505-07:00Three Points:
I totally agree that students at NO...Three Points:<br /><br />I totally agree that students at NOVA need, and should have, the building.<br /><br />This whole situation could, and should, have been avoided by better planning.<br /><br />The fallout (and setbacks) from the recent legal rulings is intense for many African Americans (and others) and should not be ignored or underestimated. It is an important context that should be provided and understood when discussing the current situation at Horace Mann.<br /><br />(enough already--forgot to sign)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-72450623928267981672013-08-16T23:25:42.597-07:002013-08-16T23:25:42.597-07:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-16240255519829132812013-08-16T22:06:48.394-07:002013-08-16T22:06:48.394-07:00I live in the CD. The building now housing the Af...I live in the CD. The building now housing the African American Museum was never going to be used as a school again and the history of the occupation and sale of that building may be a part of the current trouble. The Feds gave the District the funds to rebuild a new Coleman (Thurgood Marshall after the freeway destroyed much of the housing.) and therefore the situation is very different. Mann is going to be used by Seattle Schools. The current program/s have used it for a very short period of time and exactly how many students for how many hours per year is still a mystery to me. However,both the African American Museum is at the old Coleman building and AME owns the old Marin Luther King School It is unfortunate that the groups cannot work together, While the process of the last school closures and musical chairs of programs in the CD was especially sloppy and contributed to this issue, this does not entitle any group with a short term lease to the building. My understanding is that old MLK, which was sold to AME, remains underutilized. Therefore, this community group could work with them or others for some space. NOVA has a much longer history of using that space and is a District program. Even if NOVA was completely new to the space, any District program/school has priority to use the space that belongs to the public and the public schools. <br /><br />Get a grip.joannanoreply@blogger.com