tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post5227875749484970138..comments2024-03-28T02:21:17.452-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: Transition Plan Tie-breakersMelissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger60125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-42536414563671641972011-01-19T12:58:32.647-08:002011-01-19T12:58:32.647-08:00QA Parent,
My example of splitting up Hay was als...QA Parent,<br /><br />My example of splitting up Hay was also an exaggeration just to make a point - like the 25 enrollment. <br /><br />My point is, when SPS states they are opening a school with the goal to relieve crowding at other schools in that service area, then SPS should give kids from those crowded schools preference in the tie breaker via geo zone in order to actually meet that goal.<br /><br />The accurate enrollment #s are provided since some commenters stated that the tie breaker scenario wouldn't happen anyway as it is a new school, all kids will get in, why is this lady crying? However - QAE will be full at many of the grade levels. So these tiebreakers could apply.<br /><br />But the ship has sailed in terms of impacting the geozone size so time will tell how it plays out. <br /><br />POLAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-59704139343823599092011-01-19T09:17:57.969-08:002011-01-19T09:17:57.969-08:00maureen is correct:
As it's currently written...maureen is correct:<br /><br />As it's currently written (Tuesday's posting), the Transition Plan does not allow newly identified students to enter the APP/IB program. They have to be current APP 8th graders or, if new to the District (from another school district), they have to show participation in a similar gifted program. <br /><br />This is NOT how the new program was sold to parents at the Ingraham meeting. Parents were given the impression that students could test in for 9th grade, even if they hadn't opted in to APP for middle school. <br /><br />Tired of Broken PromisesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-7779122508229643342011-01-19T07:25:29.199-08:002011-01-19T07:25:29.199-08:00Lots of changes to the Transition Plan - posted to...Lots of changes to the Transition Plan - posted to the Board Agenda on Tuesday. <br /><br />-?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-38799207758285513502011-01-19T00:28:26.373-08:002011-01-19T00:28:26.373-08:00No POL, splitting up grades at Hay is a particula...No POL, splitting up grades at Hay is a particularly dumb idea, and it lasted for about 1 week. There are several programs at Hay that can't be split along grade levels. And, nobody wants to split up siblings, just because some other people want lots of choices. Yes, the district told everybody QA is getting another school because it needs it. That is true. So what? QA is, in fact, getting a school to relieve crowding. They never said other people couldn't attend it. And the crowding that needs relieving, is exactly located in the geozone. That's what it's for! The complainers are actually from schools that are NOT over-crowded. If the alternative issue is so important, then there should be NO special preference for QA/Mag residence at all. You can't really have it both ways. It seems you are arguing for middle school service area tie breakers. But that's no good either. All the alternative schools are pretty unique and many think you should get a choice and a chance at one that meets your needs. But the reality is, without transportation, it is highly unlikely that any school in QA or Mag will attract students out of the neighborhood.<br /><br />I'm sure the 25 number was an exaggeration to make a point.<br /><br />QA ParentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-52049351529942016392011-01-18T23:51:50.527-08:002011-01-18T23:51:50.527-08:00The question about (non-APP) 8th graders qualifyin...The question about (non-APP) 8th graders qualifying for the APP/IB at Ingraham was specifically asked at the meeting held at Ingraham. Dr. Vaughan responded that, yes, students could test in for 9th grade. <br /><br />Is this now different? It was one of the more appealing aspects of the proposed program - an accelerated pathway for those not choosing APP in middle school.<br /><br />-?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-70771090865341786002011-01-18T22:42:13.321-08:002011-01-18T22:42:13.321-08:00you know what kills me about this list? it's E...you know what kills me about this list? it's EXACTLY what the NSAP was supposed to FIX - a bunch of ad hoc/band aid, school by school solutions/preferences designed as work-arounds for specific groups to skirt the system. They should all be dismissed on principle.<br /><br />Oh and I don't have an opinion on geo zones for TC, but for those who say VR can just add portables (true, technically, on playground) at what # over 600 does an elementary school become too big? VR will exceed Bryant's 'biggest in system' size this year, for certain. The infrasructure - gym, auditorium, parking, etc are all for smaller #;s. These issues are front and center at almost every NE school, old hat at bryant, not just VR, TC's growth plan has similar constraints, but guess what - nothings really be fixed!<br /><br />The issue is: no real data was used to draw boundaries, they are effectivley wrong in many cases and no one is copping to the problem or willing to fix it. <br /><br />So, what to do? change the bell times. again. without input. grr. ignore capacity problems, hope they resolve themselves magically and that existing grade schoolers don't actaully rise up to middle school on time, or high school for that matter, b/c we won't be ready.<br /><br />Yes, I'm ranting. who wouldn't?nacmomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00371426636516809805noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-41007041229953418002011-01-18T22:40:08.991-08:002011-01-18T22:40:08.991-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.nacmomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00371426636516809805noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-19781912567076209202011-01-18T21:03:21.898-08:002011-01-18T21:03:21.898-08:00The NSAP Transition has no provision for newly ide...The NSAP Transition has no provision for newly identified Advanced Learners to enroll in the Accelerated IB program at Ingraham. It only accounts for existing APP students enrolled at HIMS or WMS for 8th grade. When the program was presented (in December?), they said there would be a way for new students to enroll.Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-29305807011631150362011-01-18T16:53:33.154-08:002011-01-18T16:53:33.154-08:00Part II:
At the moment only 45% of the students at...Part II:<br />At the moment only 45% of the students at Stevens currently live in the Stevens area. The families near Stevens and Lowell have two schools that they can actually find walkable, Lowell and Stevens. Your work to accommodate all the a kindergarten classes at Stevens this year, 20 of whom live outside the area contributed to this problem. The students and families in the area of proposed change should not pay the price. Why no public engagement on this?<br /><br />Are we serious about neighborhood schools?<br /><br />Currently only 45% of the students at Stevens actually live in the Stevens area, a situation that has been exacerbated by the continuing of out-of-area siblings. Yes, this still means that the area drawn for Stevens has a few more students than it should. Nonetheless, Kay's plan would only shift that burden to Madrona and do nothing to serve the families in the area that she is proposing to change. This area deserves a stable assignment process, and definitely does not deserve to be shifted again with no public engagement. If in the 2014, we can work to get TT Minor back as a desirable neighborhood school then the discussion can be had. (I had thought that it could happen sooner.) 400+ students live in the area of TT Minor, a very walkable area. Many of the families here breathed a sigh of relief after TT Minor was closed. If we could not work on that school then at least the new assignment gave families a choice of a stable known quantity.<br /><br />Only 33% of the students who live in the Lowell area choose to attend that school. A few of those may be APP. Nonetheless, this represents a program that is not attracting neighborhood students and allows a large number of APP students to dominate the school. It should probably be all APP. That is another discussion that can be had only if TT Minor is back as a school. Otherwise, leave this area alone and let the areas close to Stevens and Lowell divvy up their areas for balanced numbers. They can easily walk to either. These students also often chose TOPS or even Montlake, all quite close to where they live. Montlake and TOPS both are common choices for these students. In fact, Montlake might have a difficult remaining full if students from Stevens and Leschi did not choose it, even with the only a 250 student capacity.<br /><br />The currently the problem with the enrollment at Madrona is not the number of students living in its area, it is the number who choose Madrona. Currently 22% of the students living in the Madrona area choose to attend the school. If a good popular program were to be placed there then the school would eventually be overcrowded with at least 260 elementary age students in the area plus the 150 that would come from the new area being proposed for the K-5 portion. This school was not designed to accommodate 500+ K-5 students. This does not take into account the number of students that might come out of private school. These families would not then necessarily choose the middle school portion of Madrona over Washington. Remember this is an attempt to force them to an elementary choice, not a K-8 choice. TOPS is supposedly our alternative school, though far removed. Most would still be looking to get to Washington if the historical patterns continued, and there is no evidence to contradict that pattern.<br /><br />I know from experience that students west of 23rd have always qualified for transportation and have never been considered in a walk area. 23rd and MLK are both major arterials.<br /><br />I am disappointed by this last minute attempt to force these families into chaos one more tijoannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02017196722611730669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-66348412437921924152011-01-18T16:52:16.834-08:002011-01-18T16:52:16.834-08:00my post it too long. Part I:
School Board members...my post it too long. Part I:<br />School Board members, I am basically forwarding you my letter to Kay Smith-Blum to you in hopes that you will care about not only the fairness of this situation but also the practicality of what is happening here. There has been neither any public engagement nor any public examination of the facts. I am disappointed in the fact that no attempt to publicly engage any of the affected families or the community. This change represents no community engagement and in no way represents the interests of the students and families. This amendment seems to have been drafted out of concern for only the Stevens/Lowell area families who want to attend Stevens. If you are serious about a plan for TT Minor begin it now with community engagement. After all it would have to be ready to go by 2013 for a choice, right?joannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02017196722611730669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-69004031506992834602011-01-18T16:03:37.501-08:002011-01-18T16:03:37.501-08:00For those of you discussing QAE - some facts might...For those of you discussing QAE - some facts might help the thought process:<br /><br />There are not 25 students but actually 115 students currently with K, K/1, 2, and 3/4/5 <br />classrooms, all around 28+ kids. <br /><br />QAE will likely have 2 classrooms each next year at the K-3 grades based on many factors, including overcrowding at Hay, excellent principal and staff, but also very high interest from parents who are waiting for the school to be located in the neighborhood. Two last minute open houses at a parent's home were packed - over 50 attendees each - and people are asking how to sign up for next year already. <br /><br />So the tie-breaker scenario employing the geo-zone is real.<br /><br />Why would a QA/Magnolia parent outside the geo zone be upset that they may be in a lottery with other students outside the McClure service area? <br /><br />Because they were told over and over that the whole reason for opening the school in the first place was to relieve crowding in QA/Magnolia schools. <br /><br />If all the district wanted to do was relieve crowding at John Hay, they should have used the split campus idea they had in the first place the poster above references. <br /><br />If the idea was to open a 21st century learning technology option school for the district, then fine. But don't sell it as a capacity management play to the local parents while you are asking them to support it and make it come to life. <br /><br />POLAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-87928315045574465962011-01-18T15:39:28.655-08:002011-01-18T15:39:28.655-08:00OK, I just read the Transportation Service Guideli...OK, I just read the Transportation Service Guidelines and see that there will be two tiers of K-5 with the later tier bus arriving 20 minutes later than they do now. They are now by guidelines to arrive at 8:50 and allow 15 minutes for breakfast, I believe. So the new time is buses arrive at 9:10 for a start time of 9:25 or 9:30. Afternoon times are correspondingly later as well.<br /><br />Working MomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-29328941602981737592011-01-18T15:36:45.373-08:002011-01-18T15:36:45.373-08:00As I read the Transportation standards, there will...As I read the Transportation standards, there will be changes to start times again. <br /><br />Proposed Second tier elementary arrival/ departure: 8:35/3:00<br /><br />Proposed Third tier elementary arrival/departure: 9:10/3:45<br /><br />These are bus arrival and departure times, not school start and end times. The current arrival/departure times are 8:50/3:40. <br /><br />Inquiring parentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-73036232201892234662011-01-18T14:50:45.156-08:002011-01-18T14:50:45.156-08:00I was just thinking about the last time I felt lik...I was just thinking about the last time I felt like crying in front of Director DeBell, and it was over the proposed late (9:30ish) elementary start times which would have made my family's life difficult in many ways. I have not heard of a plan to change the elementary start times again, but I would like to know if this is in the works. <br /><br />Working MomAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-72841635610896747362011-01-18T14:24:37.929-08:002011-01-18T14:24:37.929-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-18893818269970543482011-01-18T14:21:23.443-08:002011-01-18T14:21:23.443-08:00further comments for Kay on Madrona/Stevens
http:/...further comments for Kay on Madrona/Stevens<br />http://centraldistrictnews.com/2011/01/17/proposed-school-boundary-change-for-stevens-madrona-k-8joannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02017196722611730669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-15458231848216644232011-01-18T13:49:22.967-08:002011-01-18T13:49:22.967-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.joannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02017196722611730669noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-84226597653985626622011-01-18T13:10:07.581-08:002011-01-18T13:10:07.581-08:00Have any PTSA leaders out there been invited to a ...Have any PTSA leaders out there been invited to a meeting to discuss the proposed <a href="http://www.seattleschools.org/area/board/10-11agendas/011911agenda/transportationstandards.pdf" rel="nofollow"> Transportation Service Standards?</a><br /><br /><i><b>COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT PROCESS</b><br />Prior to Vote:<br />Opportunities for engagement at the “consult” level will be through public testimony at board meetings as well as submission of comments and suggestions through cards, letters, and e-mail to www.newassign@seattleschools.org<br /> <b>Brief community leaders of PTSA and other family groups Wednesday January 19th (A.M.)</b><br /> Community meeting during the week of January 24th (Tentatively at Mercer Middle School)<br /> Place proposed Transportation Service Standards on SPS web site.</i>Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-58793167193724557582011-01-18T11:42:54.572-08:002011-01-18T11:42:54.572-08:00The new transportation standards propose a three-t...The new transportation standards propose a three-tier bus schedule (changed from a two-tier schedule). <br /><br />Does anyone know which schools will be affected for next year? Speaking personally, I would love it if my child's elementary went back to an earlier start time, but would loathe an even later start/end time.<br /><br />Inquiring parentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-76659775711483601652011-01-18T10:22:22.208-08:002011-01-18T10:22:22.208-08:00The new QA elementary is about a quarter mile from...The new QA elementary is about a quarter mile from John Hay, which is unbelievably oversubscribed. The capacity management plan 2 years ago was to actually put the 4th and 5th grades of Hay, into the "Old Hay" building... now renamed QA Elementary. Another plan had been to put the kindergarten of Hay into "Old Hay". The two schools essentially share what normal people would consider a "walk zone". It would be really hard to draw any type of zone or attendance area around QA elementary that didn't actually include Hay, or vise versa. That is, you'd probably wind up with a zone where the school wasn't even in it's own attendance area. If they did make all three school attendance area schools, the maps would surely be unbelievably weird, and people would be up in arms.<br /><br />QA parentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-47098293084419249382011-01-18T07:51:08.347-08:002011-01-18T07:51:08.347-08:00Kelly do you know if any Middle School kids get Ti...<b>Kelly</b> do you know if any Middle School kids get Title-1/no-AYP busing? I wonder if there are kids who wanted to get to Salmon Bay but couldn't, so were bused to a different MS that made AYP instead? I expect this is true of many of AS#1's K-8th graders and know it will be true of about 1/4 of TOPS' K-5 kids if busing isn't grandfathered. And that doesn't even account for the additional tutoring costs for kids assigned to Title 1 schools.<br /><br />When will SPS staff start thinking in terms of NET costs across the system instead of the gross costs inside each of their little silos?Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-64659976754814533272011-01-18T00:39:16.906-08:002011-01-18T00:39:16.906-08:00Wow, there's some capacity managment in action...Wow, there's some capacity managment in action. Take away the all-city transportation for Salmon Bay middle school, and poof - no more wait list.Kellynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-66208849144424518812011-01-17T20:23:34.708-08:002011-01-17T20:23:34.708-08:00WOW Jan ......
next you will likely have me imagi...WOW Jan ......<br /><br />next you will likely have me imagine Board members who actually make evidence based decisions.<br /><br />The Superintendent's planning is pathetic and her execution is worse ... the audit was a disaster so the Board extended her contract an additional year.<br /><br />I like the imagining .... It really makes an impact. It is hard to envision "what doing things correctly" would look like after years of misfeasance, malfeasance, and incompetence. Thanks for the reminder that "this could be done". .... Just not by these folks.dan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-63283403683576825762011-01-17T19:14:48.040-08:002011-01-17T19:14:48.040-08:00Close your eyes and imagine, for a moment, an &quo...Close your eyes and imagine, for a moment, an "other" MGJ, an "other" District Staff. A staff that gathered a lot of parent input on things like Montessori, LI, and alt schools before proposing the SAP, made ALL of them option schools, and started the process 3 years ago of siting them equitably. A superintendent who came to the board two years ago and said -- the SE Initiative has not had measurable results. I propose postponing the SAP for another year or two, until we have SE school choices that work for, and attract, the families who will be assigned to them. Otherwise, we risk an unfair and unstable school assignment process. A staff that had introduced IB (if that is the fix they are proposing) to RBHS 3 years ago as part of the SE Initiative -- rather than scrambling to start it up next year.Janhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09923777229601243321noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-34487198044296810552011-01-17T19:04:24.383-08:002011-01-17T19:04:24.383-08:00Charlie said:
In other words, if the District scr...Charlie said:<br /><br />In other words, if the District screws up and draws the attendance area boundary wrong and the school is overcrowded, then they will put the entire burden of the solution on out-of-area students.<br /><br />This is a dreadful reversal of the assurances that the Board and the staff gave people about choice and access all through the process and discussions about the New Student Assignment Plan.<br /><br />Thank you, Charlie -- for saying so elequantly what I also think. All those pre-NSAP parents who worried about school quality (knowing what school they were likely assigned to) or who wanted IB, etc. How many times did we hear about how the 10% choice solution would ease all these problems. And now, we have things like -- Garfield kids who want, say, the Center School, getting the ability to go there over RBHS kids trying to get to some school other than RBHS. It helps the district staff deal with the incredible, predicteable blunder that they made with the Garfield boundaries, yes, -- but fair to the RBHS kid (who, by the way, has no HOPE of getting into GHS, due to crowding)? <br /><br />I love GHS, and my kids go there, but I would have gone to double GHS shifts before I started giving GHS attendance area kids priority over RBHS or other kids stuck in historically underselected schools who are seeking available choice seats.Janhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09923777229601243321noreply@blogger.com