tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post748696342808074155..comments2024-03-29T02:41:52.718-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: Two Tiers or Three? The City Council Will DecideMelissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger78125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-48391670587309957602017-06-14T12:41:56.652-07:002017-06-14T12:41:56.652-07:00@numbers,
Yes, I understand, which is why I aske...@numbers, <br /><br />Yes, I understand, which is why I asked for the raw numbers from Alex in the first place. I don't think the point Alex was trying to make necessarily follows from the analysis of the data that was posted. Depending on the raw numbers, I think a stronger case can be made, but maybe not.<br /><br />~KMG365<br /><br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-45261156653179076622017-06-11T09:32:52.291-07:002017-06-11T09:32:52.291-07:00From Alex's numbers, 44% of Tier 1 schools are...From Alex's numbers, 44% of Tier 1 schools are classified as Title 1 (23/52). 96% of all Tier 1 schools logged increased tardies compared with last year (were all of those switched from Tier 2 to Tier 1?), and 44% of all Tier 1 schools had increased tardies of 50% or more. What would be helpful from a numbers perspective is to know raw number of tardies as a baseline. Schools with low numbers of tardies to start with will show a substantial %increase compared with those schools who had high numbers of tardies even before the switch. <br /><br />Numbers aside, if the net effect is to loose a half hour of morning class time, to allow for late students to filter in, then it's impacting not just those students who are tardy, but even those who show up on time. That, to me, is the bigger problem. The elementary day has effectively been cut short by switching the schools to Tier 1. The district should also compare meal rates - compared to last year, what is the percent decrease in those receiving school provided breakfast? <br /><br />-numbersAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-77578146955041563632017-06-11T08:54:58.805-07:002017-06-11T08:54:58.805-07:00@KMG, it depends on what percent of schools receiv...@KMG, it depends on what percent of schools receive Title 1 funding. Throwing out a random number of 20%, just for example: If 52% of the schools experiencing increased tardies were Title 1, but they only make up 20% of the schools, then the numbers would suggest they are disproportionately impacted. Another way to process and present the numbers would be to say, "Of Title 1 schools, [ ]% saw increased tardies, whereas only [ ]% of non-Title 1 schools saw increased tardies." <br /><br />-numbers<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-15619429099672154662017-06-10T22:54:46.821-07:002017-06-10T22:54:46.821-07:00@Alex,
You said:
"The data show that this i...@Alex,<br /><br />You said:<br /><br />"The data show that this is very much an equity issue" <br />and<br />"Furthermore, there is a disproportionate impact at the title I schools"<br /><br />but the only data you give that supports these statements is:<br /><br />· 52% (12/23) of the schools that had an increase of 50% or more in tardy students were title I schools.<br /><br />So, 52% title one schools vs. 48% non-title one schools? I wouldn't call that particularly disproportionate.<br /><br />~KMG365Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-30800670827354394862017-06-09T17:04:47.669-07:002017-06-09T17:04:47.669-07:00Pegi McEvoy (Assistant Superintendent of Operation...Pegi McEvoy (Assistant Superintendent of Operations) talked about the data at the board meeting last week. But to my knowledge she hasn't posted or released the data anywhere. BM Observernoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-11938245128719113742017-06-09T14:55:44.961-07:002017-06-09T14:55:44.961-07:00Update: 1) SPS did the data analysis. All I did wa...Update: 1) SPS did the data analysis. All I did was count. 2) my summary stats have now been reviewed by an accountant & a professor. I stand by my data as presented. alexhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01999319161830539952noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-70722824536919192582017-06-09T12:21:26.862-07:002017-06-09T12:21:26.862-07:00Question on Anonymous BM Observer's post:
...<br />Question on Anonymous BM Observer's post: <br /><br /> Apparently Pegi McEvoy has data comparing class time missed by athletes from last year to this year. Many sports missed *less* class time this year than last, 2 sports were about the same, and 5 sports have kids that missed more time this year than last. The district chartered buses to mitigate this year; she has more ideas for solutions to continue to decrease the amount of class time missed for next year.<br /><br />Anyone know where this data is? Sounds like she presented publicly somewhere ... Any to see that data? Or can anyone explain why there seems to be such disparate impacts depending on the specific sport?<br /><br />--Concerned parentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-16435274753646637352017-06-08T21:00:14.275-07:002017-06-08T21:00:14.275-07:00Why do they need to be shorter? Can't they jus...Why do they need to be shorter? Can't they just run later?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-73399095597712174352017-06-08T19:10:04.356-07:002017-06-08T19:10:04.356-07:00All of our Title I and other high-needs schools w...All of our Title I and other high-needs schools who benefit greatly by our academic programs for students after school which have shown to greatly reduce the academic achievement gap. These programs have already had to be reduced due to this year's later start time, and now the proposal is for even later start times?! It is not just Sports!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-72930074371735576392017-06-08T17:09:08.425-07:002017-06-08T17:09:08.425-07:00Need analysis,
I don't have high school age c...Need analysis,<br /><br />I don't have high school age children yet but the idea of "shifting bedtimes" made me chuckle. Back when I was in high school, school started at 7:20. I had a rigorous after-school schedule, and took AP classes. And still, I didn't go to sleep til at least 11PM. I simply wasn't tired til then. It was the same story for most of my friends. And we'd all sleep til noon on the weekends. <br /><br />I didn't think much of it until all these sleep studies came out saying that that's normal for the circadian rhythms of teens. Now it makes perfect sense. <br /><br />-Pollyanna Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-89167470860731961722017-06-08T17:04:26.601-07:002017-06-08T17:04:26.601-07:00Wait I thought the pop tax is going to close the a...Wait I thought the pop tax is going to close the achievement gap.<br /><br />Dos peeps got to get their pieorites strate up.<br /><br />Big BooAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-73350254337013981862017-06-08T17:03:28.177-07:002017-06-08T17:03:28.177-07:00I would suggest that those who have concerns do th...I would suggest that those who have concerns do the research on what the district and the taskforce considered before this passed. Also, do the research on what other districts around the country are doing who have later start times. Ask for that data yourself from the district.<br /><br />That's what I would suggest.<br />Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-83158818909068666342017-06-08T16:18:16.719-07:002017-06-08T16:18:16.719-07:00I agree! There's so much more to it than Spor...I agree! There's so much more to it than Sports, which is what the focus has been in this stream. Enough time for after school tutoring and academic programs are vital in keeping our students progressing and closing the achievement gap!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-28445256598808671242017-06-08T16:15:53.042-07:002017-06-08T16:15:53.042-07:00HS students (on average) have to travel longer dis...HS students (on average) have to travel longer distances than ES students. The new bell times are closer to rush hour times, any extra sleep time will be eaten by traffic for these students.<br /><br />I reluctantly sent my request for the two tier system, not because it's a good solution, but because it's the "least worst" option.<br /><br />And who is paying for those chartered buses??<br /><br />Couldn't PD be done before school for MS and HS?<br /><br /><br />-BarfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-67136181643557386242017-06-08T16:03:36.093-07:002017-06-08T16:03:36.093-07:00@flipside,
1) Are MS/HS students actually gettin...@flipside, <br /><br />1) Are MS/HS students actually getting more sleep, or have they just shifted their bedtimes later? <br />2) Have there been fewer or more late buses, overall, this year over last? (and if the bus is on time, but fewer ES students are making it to the bus, what's the net impact?)<br />3) Many elementary tutoring programs rely on middle school and high school volunteers (Team Read, for example). If they are in school until 3:50, but elementary gets out over an hour earlier, who is doing the tutoring? And with such a late release, how many MS/HS students will be able to volunteer?<br />4) Do elementary students rely on paid jobs? <br /><br />You can keep repeating "sleep science says..." but it's irresponsible to dismiss concerns about unintended consequences. Elementary students need sleep, too. The district should be collecting data and feedback, and asking if they've really made a change that's best for all students. <br /><br />-need analysisAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-32874681930201382652017-06-08T15:32:10.424-07:002017-06-08T15:32:10.424-07:00No HS needs to start 8:30 or later. If it starts ...No HS needs to start 8:30 or later. If it starts earlier, kids sleep in class. Every study has shown that high schoolers need a later start.<br /><br />HPAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-8121211183070721322017-06-08T15:27:02.855-07:002017-06-08T15:27:02.855-07:00There have always been trade offs for playing spor...There have always been trade offs for playing sports. For FB, training starts in August well before the start of the school year. Keeping up your grades even with the added practice schedule is required. The schools have no obligation to adjust anything to accommodate sports the committed athletes make the adjustment without whining about it. <br /><br />Grow up<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-6967526276936313982017-06-08T14:23:59.151-07:002017-06-08T14:23:59.151-07:00@ sleep deprived, that's pretty biased. Couldn...@ sleep deprived, that's pretty biased. Couldn't all those same points be flipped for the other group of students? <br /><br />In other words, SPS needs to NOT flip MS/HS back to Tier 1, retaining the later start time for teens and tweens. Positive impacts of this recent change include:<br /><br />- increased sleep for MS and HS students (which, research suggests, has positive impacts on academic performance, accident prevention, mental and physical health, risky behaviors, etc.)<br />- fewer late buses for ES students<br />- more time for afterschool tutoring for ES students<br />- more time for afterschool activities and sports for ES students <br /><br />flipsideAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-91847380501178542082017-06-08T13:45:25.196-07:002017-06-08T13:45:25.196-07:00SPS needs to consider flipping MS/HS back to Tier ...SPS needs to consider flipping MS/HS back to Tier 1. Negative impacts of the flip include:<br /><br />-increased tardies (and less sleep) for ES students<br />-more late buses for MS/HS (do schools keep logs?)<br />-less time for afterschool tutoring<br />-less time for afterschool activities/sports/jobs<br /><br />sleep deprived<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-68720163924126584972017-06-08T12:54:49.516-07:002017-06-08T12:54:49.516-07:00 With a later start time this school year, already... With a later start time this school year, already data has shown that the problem of poor attendance has actually increased for elementary schools students and the data on attendance for high school and middle schools has remained the same as previously when they started earlier.<br /><br />In addition, there have been huge impacts to after school programs and sports programs for secondary students. At Title 1 schools where we count on helping students after school who are behind academically, this year we have to cut the amount of time we have them after school due to the later start and end time of school. The proposed change to starting and ending school even later for next year would force us to have to cut this important time with our students even down further!<br /><br />As a parent, I will not be allowing my son to continue playing in high school sports next year, because with the later start time, he would have to miss 2 hours of school or more on a regular basis, just to attend away games. This is not acceptable because academics come first!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-25143438774972728992017-06-08T12:51:56.844-07:002017-06-08T12:51:56.844-07:00Children first,
I totally get what you're sa...Children first, <br /><br />I totally get what you're saying, in theory. In practice, I grew up in a district with an early release on Wednesdays (one hour early, elementary through high school) and everyone functioned just fine. Particularly in middle and high schools, Wednesdays were often, for example, days where a teacher might give a unit test, because it suited the shorter length of time. If given on another day, you'd have "free time" after students finished that was more or less useless. No, you wouldn't schedule a long lab on a Wednesday. But the point was, each individual class was shortened by a matter of minutes and it wasn't that big a difference (because the time spent in-between classes, and lunch, had to remain the same). Many districts across the country have been doing this for 30 years. <br /><br />-Pollyanna Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-38326804108155910562017-06-08T12:25:41.842-07:002017-06-08T12:25:41.842-07:00BM Observer, I heard McEvoy's testimony and wi...BM Observer, I heard McEvoy's testimony and will ask her about those solutions.Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-89459920043276997572017-06-08T11:30:49.700-07:002017-06-08T11:30:49.700-07:00Re: INSANE Wednesday early releases for next year
...Re: INSANE Wednesday early releases for next year<br /><br /><br />Professional learning communities for teachers are vital and important. All families support teachers accessing meaningful professional development. But it should not come at a cost to our students or family life. <br /><br />Many of us in our jobs often participate in continuing professional education and training, but it doesn't mean we make our clients and customers work around our schedules at their significant inconvenience.<br /><br /> I find it appalling. Teachers are professionals, and like attorneys, accountants, lawyers, programmers, engineers, etc., it's unclear why they don't schedule their professional ongoing training and collaboration in a way that does not interfere and impact children and families whom they serve.<br /><br /> The length of day for instruction needs to suit a child. You can't take a cake it's supposed to be baked at a certain temperature for a certain length of time and play around with those variables. You can't take a school day and make it extra long or really short and expect kids to be able to get the same useful learning experience as a specifically designed developmentally-appropriate length of day.<br /><br />Children firstAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-38385671501794873422017-06-08T11:18:56.351-07:002017-06-08T11:18:56.351-07:00Moving to 2 tiers, while an improvement in that it...Moving to 2 tiers, while an improvement in that it gets rid of the awful Tier 3 for some schools, will essentially shift the Tier 3 time to MS/HS. The approved bell schedule for MS/HS, with 2 tiers, is 9:00 to 3:50, with arrival/departure at 8:45 and 4:00. Arrival/departure for ES will be 7:45 and 2:40.<br /><br />If SPS was to flip back to original start times for MS/HS, Tier 1 would be 7:50 to 2:40 and Tier 2 ES could be 9:00 to 3:30.<br /><br />-reflipAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-72054988248180956682017-06-08T11:00:02.815-07:002017-06-08T11:00:02.815-07:00Back in the day we always missed school for FB gam...Back in the day we always missed school for FB games until varsity (All games at MS at night)Back then the fields for JV games were not lit like today, so we needed to play during daylight. No big deal and not a civil rights issue.<br /><br />Geez Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com