tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post7526123595743994710..comments2024-03-28T02:21:17.452-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: This Week's Assignment Plan/Math Adoption MeetingsMelissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger53125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-52412849939890401762009-04-01T20:51:00.000-07:002009-04-01T20:51:00.000-07:00ds,Introduction on April 8 and vote on April 22. ...ds,<BR/><BR/>Introduction on April 8 and vote on April 22. If you wish to testify on April 8th call 206-252-0040 at 8AM sharp on Monday April 6. Meetings start at 6 PM. Three minute testimonies are usually done by 7 PM. Watching the Admin's pitch for Discovering will be better in person than on TV, so plan to stay awhile. Better yet make a sign and bring it.<BR/><BR/>Live political theater what a treat.<BR/><BR/>Dandan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-21941557883035911372009-04-01T16:05:00.000-07:002009-04-01T16:05:00.000-07:00Can you please post your powerpoint to Harium's si...Can you please post your powerpoint to Harium's site, Dan? It really hammers home the point, and I think as many people as possible need to see it...and then write the board ASAP (I think the vote is 4/22...does anyone know for sure?)<BR/><BR/>Sherry Carr sherry.carr@seattleschools.org<BR/><BR/>Harium Martin-Morris<BR/>harium.martin-morris@seattleschools.org<BR/><BR/>Peter Maier<BR/>peter.maier@seattleschools.org<BR/><BR/>Cheryl Chow<BR/>cheryl.chow@seattleschools.org<BR/><BR/>Steve Sundquist<BR/>steve.sundquist@seattleschools.org<BR/><BR/>Mary Bass<BR/>mary.bass@seattleschools.org<BR/><BR/>Michael DeBell (President)<BR/>michael.debell@seattleschools.orgdshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04318049812274491254noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-27929615792607431692009-04-01T14:11:00.000-07:002009-04-01T14:11:00.000-07:00Dan posted: "You be the Judge is "Discovering Alge...Dan posted: <BR/><BR/>"You be the Judge is "Discovering Algebra" mathematically unsound?<BR/><BR/>A Power Point:<BR/>http://www.mathunderground.net/Prentice-Hall_vs_Dissolving-Algebra.ppt "<BR/><BR/>I have an advanced degree in math and the discovering series confuses me. This CANNOT be allowed to be our HS text. <BR/><BR/>Who is the best person for me to contact? My board member? I'm new to this blog and need help on how to stop this madness.Karriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14650432496008469559noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-58735608739108192022009-04-01T12:13:00.000-07:002009-04-01T12:13:00.000-07:00Oh my gosh!!I checked out the PowerPoint that Dan ...Oh my gosh!!<BR/><BR/>I checked out the PowerPoint that Dan posted and I am shocked!!<BR/><BR/>For me, the fundamental exercise in algebra is to solve a single variable equation by isolating the variable. The Prentice Hall book teaches it rather elegantly. The Discovering Algebra text is a total mess. It is worse than useless because it actually confuses the issue.<BR/><BR/>I'm convinced that adopting these textbooks would do untold damage to students that would last them all of their lives.<BR/><BR/>The Board needs to reject these textbooks and they need to reject them soundly.Charlie Mashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17173903762962067277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-75625356331581989442009-03-31T06:18:00.000-07:002009-03-31T06:18:00.000-07:00Some second thoughts on IB.It may be that IB is so...Some second thoughts on IB.<BR/><BR/>It may be that IB is so inquiry based that it misses significant Core Knowledge.<BR/><BR/>From Science News...<BR/>Try a few thoughts about science education here:<BR/><A HREF="http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/090326114415.htm" REL="nofollow"> http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/090326114415.htm </A>dan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-36166197964389360712009-03-31T06:09:00.000-07:002009-03-31T06:09:00.000-07:00Maureen,I agree a primary IB push might be a good ...Maureen,<BR/><BR/>I agree a primary IB push might be a good idea.<BR/><BR/>Here is a link to middle school IB:<BR/><A HREF="http://www.ibo.org/myp/" REL="nofollow"> http://www.ibo.org/myp/ </A><BR/><BR/>or check out the IB primary school program:<BR/><A HREF="http://www.ibo.org/" REL="nofollow"> http://www.ibo.org/ </A><BR/><BR/>It looks like IB can start at age 3. This could be the only way other than private school that many families can avoid the SPS k-12 math disaster. (as well as other SPS curricular disasters) Hopefully North Beach can keep Saxon Math and Schmitz Park can keep Singapore Math.<BR/><BR/>It would be nice if the SPS started an emphasis on Core Knowledge. As things stand now in many areas there is so much emphasis on process that the students have nothing to process.dan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-65240314842325928522009-03-30T21:04:00.000-07:002009-03-30T21:04:00.000-07:00But IB doesn't start until 11th grade. I wonder i...But IB doesn't start until 11th grade. I wonder if they can keep Unified Math for the "pre-IB" classes in 9th and 10th? If so, I'm seeing a big reason for North Beach families to be happy they won't be assigned to Ballard anymore! I'm also seeing a reason for Addams families to push for a primary IB program.Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-48205062925893573672009-03-30T18:48:00.000-07:002009-03-30T18:48:00.000-07:00Maureen,Helen is right on. The IB program trumps ...Maureen,<BR/><BR/>Helen is right on. The IB program trumps the math adoption recommendations.<BR/><BR/>Dandan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-36692767680679160262009-03-30T16:43:00.000-07:002009-03-30T16:43:00.000-07:00Ingraham uses Unified Math (an out-of-print but we...Ingraham uses Unified Math (an out-of-print but well-regarded math series that integrates algebra and geometry, but is otherwise fairly traditional) for its algebra/geometry sequence. I don't know what Sealth uses, nor what either program uses for IB-specific math. (I don't any longer remember exactly when IB math kicks in -- whether as part of the algebra/geometry sequence, or not until the precalculus/calculus portion.)<BR/><BR/>Helen Schinskehschinskehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10316478950862562594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-18824774636362896182009-03-30T16:36:00.000-07:002009-03-30T16:36:00.000-07:00Does anyone (Dan?!) know if the IB programs are re...Does anyone (Dan?!) know if the IB programs are required to use whatever math texts the District adopts? That doesn't seem possible given the structure of the courses.Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-71472097624408745972009-03-29T22:28:00.000-07:002009-03-29T22:28:00.000-07:00You be the Judge is "Discovering Algebra" mathemat...You be the Judge is "Discovering Algebra" mathematically unsound?<BR/><BR/> A Power Point:<BR/><A HREF="http://www.mathunderground.net/Prentice-Hall_vs_Dissolving-Algebra.ppt" REL="nofollow"> http://www.mathunderground.net/Prentice-Hall_vs_Dissolving-Algebra.ppt </A>dan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-12766303504751904652009-03-29T21:11:00.000-07:002009-03-29T21:11:00.000-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.dan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-8874067025859239712009-03-29T20:23:00.000-07:002009-03-29T20:23:00.000-07:00Maureen,In regard to the discussion and informatio...Maureen,<BR/><BR/>In regard to the discussion and information below, your guess is as good as mine.<BR/><BR/>The district has been on a big push for differentiated instruction. They also have yet to show that their version of "Differentiated Instruction" is getting positive results.<BR/><BR/>I expect to see almost every below grade level kid in Discovering Algebra if "Discovering" is a high school instructional materials adoption. If the admin is intending to use something below "Discovering Algebra" for a large portion of the population it needs to be recommended and approved by the School Board. The SPS Admin has no recommendation below Discovering Algebra.<BR/>------------------<BR/><I>It is particularly disturbing that the Administration and the committee have recommended nothing lower than "Discovering Algebra".</I><BR/><BR/>Dan I'm not sure what this issue is here, <B>wouldn't they just use the 8th grade book from CMP2 for the kids who aren't ready for Discovering Algebra?</B> I hear they plan to use the Algebra book for 8th graders who would have been taking Int1. What do the 'remedial' 9th grade classes use now?dan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-24747240594800173232009-03-29T07:23:00.000-07:002009-03-29T07:23:00.000-07:00harium has just started a new thread on the math a...harium has just started a new thread on the math adoption.anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03716725891562757052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-85950939913703024862009-03-28T22:18:00.000-07:002009-03-28T22:18:00.000-07:00Below is the text of a comment I left on Harium Ma...Below is the text of a comment I left on Harium Martin-Morris' blog under the "New Student Assignment Plan" topic. It seems like it might belong here as well.<BR/><BR/><I>I attended the public meeting at Ballard High on Thursday evening.<BR/><BR/>Like most of the other attendees, I was pleased by the fact that the new system does not require families to use the choice system. You're guaranteed to get a place at your "attendance area school" (a new term replacing "reference school"). If you like your local school there's no call to take the time to go school shopping and list making -- just turn in a simple enrollment form and you're done. (Well, not really all that simple, because you have to document your address and fill out that immunization form yet again, but you get the point...)<BR/><BR/>One important thing to note about the proposal is that it effectively switches the relative priority of sibling and attendance area in getting into a school.<BR/><BR/>Here is a small example. Please note that I had to draw a couple of educated inferences, and the plan is constantly changing. If you hear something different from official sources, believe them first.<BR/><BR/>Consider a family living in UW student housing North of U Village. They enroll their older child in Kindergarten at Bryant, which is their attendance area school.<BR/><BR/>A few years later they buy a house in a different attendance area just before their younger child is due to enroll for Kindergarten.<BR/><BR/>In the current system, siblings have highest priority and the family could keep the older child at Bryant and take advantage of early sibling enrollment to guarantee their younger child a spot in Kindergarten at Bryant. (Well, not actually guarantee -- they could be out of luck if there were more siblings than total spaces, but that is statistically highly unlikely...)<BR/><BR/>Under the new system, the family has two choices if they wish to have their children attend the same school.<BR/><BR/>* They may keep the older child at Bryant and use the new choice process to try to get the younger sibling in. They have highest priority for available space after attendance area families. Some years there may not be enough choice spaces available to accommodate all out-of-attendance-area siblings.<BR/><BR/>* They may take a guaranteed placement for both at their new attendance area school.<BR/><BR/>Some folks in this situation will be disappointed, but it seems practical to me. Many parents in over-crowded reference areas have specifically asked for it on the quite reasonable grounds that they should not be displaced by folks no longer living in the area.<BR/><BR/>However, there's also the question of what happens to a family who doesn't move at all, but finds themselves in a different attendance area as the result of a moving boundary. As I understand the proposal, these folks will have the same options as the family who made a physical move.<BR/><BR/>I think this is going to result in a lot of disgruntlement among the affected families. Imagine establishing your child in the local school the district "wants" you to be at and then being told to start over again if you want to keep your kids together!<BR/><BR/>However, I also think that the Enrollment Department would rightly balk at having to process these two families differently. It would greatly complicate the system, requiring documenting an address history and sibling enrollment history since before the last re-draw of the lines. Ugh! There goes the simplicity, clarity, and maintainability of the system.<BR/><BR/>Any system is going to include these sorts of gotchas. I think the current proposed plan is quite good. However, I don't envy the district the task of explaining why they have to do this to families. I hope they will put more effort than they have in the past into making their explanations empathetic in addition to explaining why the resulting assignment was necessary. <BR/></I>Elizabeth Whttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04731168985909727486noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-33037581331438425052009-03-28T13:16:00.000-07:002009-03-28T13:16:00.000-07:00It is particularly disturbing that the Administrat...<I>It is particularly disturbing that the Administration and the committee have recommended nothing lower than "Discovering Algebra".</I><BR/><B>Dan</B> I'm not sure what this issue is here, wouldn't they just use the 8th grade book from CMP2 for the kids who aren't ready for Discovering Algebra? I hear they plan to use the Algebra book for 8th graders who would have been taking Int1. What do the 'remedial' 9th grade classes use now?<BR/><BR/>At the meeting I expressed my concerns about English Language Learners, given the texts' dependence on reading comprehension. She pulled out a paperback book that goes with the series that explains all of the concepts in straightforward terms with more mathmatical language and less English. I asked why they couldn't just all use that book and scrap the big, heavy, expensive hardbacks!Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-88526766869773131362009-03-28T13:02:00.000-07:002009-03-28T13:02:00.000-07:00I should point out that "Discovering" may not have...I should point out that "Discovering" may not have been developed with NSF funds but uses the same failing exploration and inquiry model as NSF funded materials.<BR/><BR/>"Discovering" is characterized by the following:<BR/>Lacks clear definitions.<BR/>Lacks sufficient clear examples.<BR/>Lacks enough problem set practice.<BR/>Lacks the coherence and cohesion necessary for readability (thus it is hostile to both Parents and Students)<BR/><B><BR/>There were reasons the "Discovering Series" was rated mathematically unsound by the State. These reasons are not being addressed by the administration.<BR/><BR/>In May 2007, Director DeBell said future adoptions would likely be influenced by the State .... well only if the School Directors listen to the State.<BR/></B>dan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-49673803700058757272009-03-28T12:25:00.000-07:002009-03-28T12:25:00.000-07:00Dear ds at 10:22 AM,This is a much larger question...Dear ds at 10:22 AM,<BR/><BR/>This is a much larger question than Prentice Hall or "Discovering".<BR/>It comes down to a vote to continue a failing k-8 exploration and inquiry program through use of "Discovering" or not. The rejection of Prentice Hall instructional materials that are better aligned with NMAP's call for "Authentic Algebra" by the committee shows a preference for philosophical alignment instead of results.<BR/><BR/>This district is miles away from an emphasis on "Core Knowledge" and mathematical content knowledge.<BR/><BR/>The SPS has 10+ years of math futility. An adoption of "Discovering" is a vote for extending math futility through at least 2014.<BR/><BR/>Food for thought at:<BR/>Twelve point foundation for change at<BR/><A HREF="http://www.educateforachange.com/12points.htm" REL="nofollow"> http://www.educateforachange.com/12points.htm</A><BR/><BR/>Please write a letter.<BR/><A HREF="http://mathunderground.blogspot.com/2009/03/your-help-needed-write-now.html" REL="nofollow"> http://mathunderground.blogspot.com/2009/03/your-help-needed-write-now.html </A><BR/><BR/>It is particularly disturbing that the Administration and the committee have recommended nothing lower than "Discovering Algebra".<BR/>Read this for the latest research on that decision:<BR/><A HREF="http://mathunderground.blogspot.com/2009/03/algebra-for-all-by-grade-9.html" REL="nofollow"> http://mathunderground.blogspot.com/2009/03/algebra-for-all-by-grade-9.html </A><BR/><BR/>Dandan dempseyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15536720661510933983noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-81436162826547884252009-03-28T06:41:00.000-07:002009-03-28T06:41:00.000-07:00Nature hates a vacuum. Rumors emerge in the absenc...Nature hates a vacuum. Rumors emerge in the absence of news. Someone says it once as conjecture and it gets repeated as rumor.<BR/><BR/>If there were more news there would be less rumor. But there is only one source of news, the District. And the District is notoriously uncommunicative.<BR/><BR/>As Mark Twain said, "A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes."Charlie Mashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17173903762962067277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-42621409237777659012009-03-27T21:30:00.000-07:002009-03-27T21:30:00.000-07:00Where are all these "rumors" coming from? Is the d...Where are all these "rumors" coming from? Is the district holding meetings behind closed doors, and someone is leaking what has been discussed? Or are all of these things simply rumor and conjecture?<BR/><BR/>I have heard from parent after parent that the Eckstein boundary is going to be drawn at 80th ave NE, yet I have seen nothing official to confirm or deny it.anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03716725891562757052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-53058897904057327472009-03-27T18:18:00.000-07:002009-03-27T18:18:00.000-07:00(Sort of related to QA/Mag HS issue) At the Tuesd...(Sort of related to QA/Mag HS issue) At the Tuesday night meeting there was a dad who was there only because he had heard that the Center School was going to be moved to Rainier Beach. Some one said--'no that came off the table' and some one else said 'actually it's back on'...but I don't know who said what and haven't heard this rumor anywhere else (so I'm spreading it here--sorry!).Maureenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18444916440000921599noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-4277932261959082262009-03-27T15:13:00.000-07:002009-03-27T15:13:00.000-07:00I find this interesting that there is a report tha...I find this interesting that there is a report that Michael De Bell is now talking about spreading out the Queen Anne/Magnolia students, in essence giving them a school to call home, but at different schools depending on where they live.<BR/><BR/>I had been under the impression that the district was going to give those neighborhoods a school of their own (and that it would likely be at Lincoln). I could wonder what happened but I can also guess.<BR/><BR/>One, Facilities said "no, no! We must have Lincoln for on-going rebuilds." (the only one I can think of is Eckstein because after Ingraham appearing on all the BEXs, I doubt they will get a rebuild). Or they want to have a huge reserve building in case of an earthquake (no kidding).<BR/><BR/>Two, they have other plans for Lincoln (although I can't think of one much better than giving the Queen Anne/Magnolia people someplace to call their own. As well, it would give the Fremont/Wallingford kids a school.)<BR/><BR/>Three, they think it will look bad to open a new high school (albeit in an existing building) if they need to close another. If you have capacity needs in one area of the city, then that's what needs to happen. If they need to close a building in the south end that doesn't mean it might never be used again.Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-57912088610433514892009-03-27T11:52:00.000-07:002009-03-27T11:52:00.000-07:00I was at the meeting last night. there were about ...I was at the meeting last night. there were about 100 people there...? I guesstimate based on at least 10 tables of 10, could have been more. <BR/><BR/>A few thoughts/comments.<BR/><BR/>1. I downloaded/printed the materials from the website right before the meeting - but they were not what Tracy presented so that was frustrating/hard to follow. But it did seem that the changes made were in response to comments from the previous 2 meetings - a plus and consistent with Tracy being open to feedback and comments.<BR/><BR/>2. Math - I was disappointed that this was a presentation only. I had to leave right at 8:30pm so didn't have time to give my comments on all the reasons I don't like the Discovering Series - I will email them instead.<BR/><BR/>3. Assignment Plan - the current set of guiding principle, "Rules", etc were covered by Tracy - quite quickly but as best she could. Then we broke into small groups to discuss/capture feedback. The timeline as I understand it is that the "rules" will be finalized in June and the actual boundaries won't be discussed until the fall of this year. They need the rules done so the computer programming can begin (but they don't need the boundaries for that yet).<BR/><BR/>Regarding ANY school boundaries, no, they have not been drawn yet.<BR/><BR/>Specifically to Ballard HS- quite a few people were at the meeting who heard via an email chain that the boundaries were set and that kids in Ballard wouldn't be able to go to "their school". <BR/><BR/>Regarding Eckstien - this didn't come up during the general discussion OR at my table.<BR/><BR/>BUT - if the district holds to the principle that no child will be bussed past one school to get to another (and I think they will hold to this), all you have to do is look at the map of where each Middle School and High School are located - it becomes very clear that there will be kids that live within a walk zone of a school that will be going somewhere else. <BR/><BR/>this is a link to the best map I can find on the SPS website.<BR/><BR/>http://www.seattleschools.org/<BR/>area/m_schools/index.dxml<BR/><BR/>Finally, economic diversity as a tiebreaker was flagged as problematic by several of the breakout groups during their report outs. <BR/><BR/>The only board member there was Michael DeBell.BadgerGalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11545194686772458709noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-12559379494138155802009-03-27T10:22:00.000-07:002009-03-27T10:22:00.000-07:00I'm not sure what to say about the math part of th...I'm not sure what to say about the math part of the meeting last night. I still have concerns about Discovering, but I haven’t seen PH (I asked Miss de la Fuente to bring the materials last night but, because it is not the text that the board is voting on, she did not), so I can’t offer an informed opinion here. I got in on this too late.<BR/><BR/>It sounds like the math adoption committee members who supported a more traditional approach felt that they could make Discovering work and that it was probably a better choice for the district as a whole. Apparently the committee reached a decision by consensus. It would be really nice if these teachers would share their ideas with other teachers and with families.<BR/><BR/>I asked Ms. de la Fuente about the lack of worked out problems in Geometry, and she agreed that that could be problematic. She said that there were supplemental materials that could be used, and it sounded like she might be willing to work on developing that supplementation as a standard part of the materials. I'll be following up with her on that.<BR/><BR/>If Discovering is approved, I think those of us who are concerned about the success of the series should be in communication with Ms. de la Fuente about what can be done to improve the chances of success, whether it’s requiring the use of specified supplemental materials, monitoring what is and isn’t working, communicating with families, etc.dshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04318049812274491254noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-10321571363423895752009-03-27T10:05:00.000-07:002009-03-27T10:05:00.000-07:00I think some individual groups discussed this, but...I think some individual groups discussed this, but the district staff did not say anything to the larger group about that specific issue other than that those were the types of issues that they'd be exploring. <BR/><BR/>Since it's still early in the process, I think the staff is open to suggestions.dshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04318049812274491254noreply@blogger.com