tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post7999716096727296080..comments2024-03-28T02:21:17.452-07:00Comments on Seattle Schools Community Forum: Work Session on MaintenanceMelissa Westbrookhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-31574971732873007962010-09-09T23:47:12.289-07:002010-09-09T23:47:12.289-07:00I'm surprised by this statement, and saddened ...I'm surprised by this statement, and saddened if it is true:<br /><br />It may well spell the end of any historic remodels as that just isn't sustainable. That we did it for our "crown jewels" of our high schools seems folly to me at this point but what's done is done.<br /><br />I don't think it is folly at all to preserve beautiful historic buildings and provide a campus students and the community can be proud of. Elementary students might not care much, but older kids do, and it is a source of community pride for generations to come. If we wanted to live in a city and community without history or soul, there are lots of choices. May I suggest Fife or Federal Way for those of you who feel this way.wsnorthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03795943009142572757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-83209245537224059182010-09-06T09:09:18.879-07:002010-09-06T09:09:18.879-07:00Oh, and two more things:
ttln: the custodian will...Oh, and two more things:<br /><br />ttln: the custodian will still be responsible for managing work orders as peincipals are supposed to be "istructional leaders" of their schools and not so much building managers.<br /><br />And, Seattle citizen, the custodial evaluation system also involves specific written criteria for every rating category on the instrument in order to quantify comprehensive scoring. These criteria were developed jointly by the union and management well before the turn of the last century (1992).<br /><br />This was a total revelation to the "team" the District needed to assemble to examine the issue for other employees. THAT'S where the money goes.Davenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-19204761454093732912010-09-06T08:41:39.833-07:002010-09-06T08:41:39.833-07:00Unlike administrators that move up the "incre...Unlike administrators that move up the "increment" scale by simply keeping from being fired, custodians and lunchroom staff must get a certain numerical rating on their evaluations in order to get increments. If they fall below, they stay status quo until improved. <br /><br />Oh yes, and work improvement plans have been part of the process of addressing poor performance for decades. Progressive,huh?<br /><br />Just took administration a long time to see the logic.<br /><br />Thanks for asking.Davenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-81915981947338681442010-09-06T08:35:16.428-07:002010-09-06T08:35:16.428-07:00Dave, I was being ironic with my comment about non...Dave, I was being ironic with my comment about non-core staff not contributing to the educational life of a student.<br /><br />I had no idea that custodial and lunch staff were paid on a merit basis. Intersting. How does that work?seattle citizenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16724175257161649500noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-45489401252346478902010-09-06T08:03:51.002-07:002010-09-06T08:03:51.002-07:00ttln, you make very good points. Thank you.
A goo...ttln, you make very good points. Thank you.<br /><br />A good example of mine was an instance where last school year a "head teacher" at the beautiful Coe elementary caused significant damage (and resulting restoration work) by DIY work there. That means a tradesman was'nt working on the backlog but on unnecessary repair.<br /><br />No union can be responsible for the words of each of its members but if you ever want an accurate picture of the reasons behind DISTRICT POLICIES AND INSTRUCTIONS to staff such as custodians, I would encourage you to contact the union directly at 206.441.8544. These are all District employees and would be happy to explain or give the backround on the hows and whys of what you are running up against.<br /><br />The work order (or lack of) system has had problems because folks downtown who have never worked in buildings (sound familiar?) decide what are priorities and apparently the blinds you mention have been lowered to the bottom of the list. I assure you that if one of them wants blinds for their workspace, it gets a high priority!<br /><br />Finally, to Seattle citizen, both custodians and lunch staff are evaluated on student contact and have been for some time. In fact until recently THEY have been the only staff in the District to have regular comprehensive evaluations and pay tied to performance. Have for many years.<br /><br />Problem is, they work on timed standard "piece work" (so many minutes to sweep so many square feet, seconds to produce a meal, etc.) and have supervisors that also work downtown (with covered windows and a code necessary to see where they work) who want them PRODUCING every minute.<br /><br />Lets focus on the "game, not the player".<br /><br />Enjoy the dialog though, very much.<br /><br />Thank you both.Davenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-18790665608056559992010-09-05T20:50:05.363-07:002010-09-05T20:50:05.363-07:00I know what you mean SC but you and I know what th...I know what you mean SC but you and I know what those people can really mean in the life of a child.Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-14671680459029490652010-09-05T18:11:02.336-07:002010-09-05T18:11:02.336-07:00No, Melissa, many of these adults who interact wit...No, Melissa, many of these adults who interact with students during a day, such as the custodian, the nurse, the librarian, and the secretary can't be making a difference because they are not evaluated as "value added" to a student's education.<br />Surely if they made a difference the district would measure and reward their contributions.<br />No, they and the art, music, PE and other certs are not contributing to a student's growth.seattle citizenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16724175257161649500noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-41735722885618899822010-09-05T15:25:25.902-07:002010-09-05T15:25:25.902-07:00ttln, that's a really good point about the kid...ttln, that's a really good point about the kids and ALL the staff in the building. Kids sometimes feel more comfortable with lunchroom staff and the custodian than they do with teachers. Anytime a kid can feel there are adults - everywhere - who care and can be counted on, it can make a difference.Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-83788255459525093652010-09-05T15:14:06.292-07:002010-09-05T15:14:06.292-07:00dave, you make assumptions about training, skills,...dave, you make assumptions about training, skills, and ability as well as my personal common sense.<br /><br />However, I see your point. Since my experience is not everyone's reality, not all are as "multi-abilitied" and experienced with such things as power tools, hanging a clock or installing a keyboard tray, or drilling holes to run cords through the back of a fixture to help a door close that doesn't because the cords come through the front...<br /><br />However, when I ask, it's the "violates their contract" answer I get. Sometimes, though, he lets me get away with it (hanging my own white board surfaces over chalkboards, for example). I do make one request about the matter, if the real issue is with potential problems that are a result of DIY on the part of teachers, then say so and do not give the "union" answer. The union answer makes the issue seem silly instead of a matter of mitigating potentially costly repairs.<br /><br />Many teacher DIY because the work orders don't get filled in a timely manner or ever, in some cases (teacher who ordered blinds hung in 2001 who, in 2009, still hadn't had blinds hung).<br /><br />By the way, I would love my custodian to come in a read with my kids and talk to them about books and their writing. It creates a school-wide environment of literacy and helps kids to see custodians as thinking, feeling, humans rather than the disrespectful views of them as "trash collector" or "floor mopper" they wrongly assume them to be. A little "out of context" interaction goes a long way toward building relationships and a school-wide climate of respect.ttlnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16036145163804967748noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-26096813991278748132010-09-05T12:17:46.838-07:002010-09-05T12:17:46.838-07:00The reason untrained staff are discouraged from dr...The reason untrained staff are discouraged from drilling holes to hang things has nothing to do with the custodains contract. No more than other untrained staff teaching students violates teacher contracts. It is because they are untrained. Miss the studs and hang film screens, clocks, etc., a few times and add even more to the maintenance backlog when the next tennant of your space wants the holes filled and repainted because you took your clock or the screen pulled out of the wall, etc., and you might understand. Until then, maybe stick to what you have been trained to do.<br /><br />That would help everyone.Davenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-24939406695473683852010-09-04T13:16:30.410-07:002010-09-04T13:16:30.410-07:00ttln, I should have said that it goes to someone a...ttln, I should have said that it goes to someone at the school instead of saying principals (although they are the ones trained on it according to the presentation). Maybe the principals will show the custodians? That issue wasn't brought up and that's a good one. <br /><br /> (Yeah, that was my thought on the union issue but I didn't know if say, the plumbers, in one union, wouldn't want to do another job belonging to another union? I don't know enough about that.)Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12588239576000641336noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-10564352286554449682010-09-04T13:07:06.710-07:002010-09-04T13:07:06.710-07:00clarification on school dude reporting (does dude ...clarification on school dude reporting (does dude stand for something?): has the point person changed? What, then, do head custodians do if the principals are in charge of work orders? Perhaps this has always been the case, but I thought that the managing of the building repairs was done by the building's head custodian. If this is a change is it compliant w/ head custodian's contract? We aren't allowed to drill a hole to hang a clock because it violates his contract. I am just curious about the confluence of roles here. (I'll bet skilled members of the crew can do 'laborer' task, at a lower rate of pay, but laborers cannot do jobs of skilled trade pros due to union regs).ttlnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16036145163804967748noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-28765366.post-70921345838028696752010-09-04T12:20:15.957-07:002010-09-04T12:20:15.957-07:00Thank you for a really important post. For those ...Thank you for a really important post. For those who don't think this is important, just look at the unacknowledged/denied impact of building condition on past closures.ebaernoreply@blogger.com