What a PR Fiasco (and why SPS will never get ahead)

Talk about backpedaling - Dr. Enfield is now saying test scores had nothing to do with Martin Floe's firing.  This is as reported by several Ingraham parents and staff.

The press release certainly made it sound like this was the case but here's what Dr. Enfield says:

Unfortunately, the Times article was not correct. While we did share Ingraham's test scores since we were getting questions about the school's performance, I never said that these scores were the reason for my decision. They were not. Additionally, I never spoke with Katherine Long so I am puzzled why she would attribute any quotes on this matter to me.

I have not, and will not, reveal the information that was part of the evaluation process and eventual decision. I am legally bound not to do so.

Katherine Long is the Times' reporter on the story.  I reread the story and Ms. Long did not attribute any quote from Dr. Enfield as given to her personally.  She quoted what parents said Dr. Enfield said.

So here are some questions:
  • by putting out the test scores, of course, everyone was going to jump to this conclusion.  If people were asking about test scores, Communications could have referred them to the OSPI site and let them do the comparisons.  Why do this?
  • Dr. Enfield is right about not saying anything legally and yet, now people believe it is about test scores at Ingraham.  I'll wait for our new Communications head to write yet another backpedaling press release.  (Recall that Sara Morris from the Alliance sent out an e-mail telling her constituents this was the reason.)  Why send the press release to people who will pass on that information?
What is happening here?  How did anyone at the district believe they could summarily fire a popular principal and have no backlash?  The district believed they could hide behind "it's a personnel matter" and people would shrug and say okay?  

This happens over and over.  These ideas are never given the "if this, then that" treatment; meaning, "what are the possible outcomes to this action and our response to them."

Again, I'm smelling subordination because this feels like someone got dissed and didn't like it.    If Principal Floe does appeal (and I hope he does), I'm sure we will get a clearer picture.   

The Board needs to put its collective foot down NOW.  This is now getting worse and worse.

If you attended a community meeting this morning, please let us know what was said.  I believe Ingraham staff is meeting with Noel Treat, our new Deputy Superintendent, on Monday and parents will meet him on Tuesday.


ArchStanton said…
So; has anyone heard from Mr. Floe?

I wonder if he is under some legal obligation to keep quiet, if he is biding his time, considering an appeal, or considering running for school board.

The way they keep disappearing principals, I'm beginning to suspect they've been shipped off to some remote gulag.
ArchStanton said…
crosspost from APP blog

Even though we fled to private last year; we saw the APP/IB @ Ingraham as having the potential to meet our needs by the time HS rolled around (and maybe it will,yet).

It seemed briefly like maybe things were getting better: MGJ gone, a little more light shining on administration as a result of Pottergate, Enfield talking the talk. I agree with pjmanley that this feels like a bait and switch and along with recent developments, clearly signals that the honeymoon is over. Well, that sure didn't take long.

This only confirms the biggest reason that we left SPS: the continual instability and uncertainty of absolutely everything - attendance areas, capacity, location of programs, continued existence of programs, transportation, start and end times, and now principals.

- All of that and the continued lack of real community engagement/communication are absolutely going to keep SPS from catching up, let alone get ahead.
Josh Hayes said…
I popped in and said hi at Ingraham yesterday; I had to drop off some paperwork anyway.

The fact is, a Principal's job is a demanding one, and I imagine he's quite busy winding the year down. I believe I read somewhere that he had retained legal representation, which suggests he DOES plan to appeal, but I can't say that with any authority.
David said…
Piecing it all together, it sounds like Executive Director Bree Duesseult and Principal Martin Floe had an argument, Martin refused to do something Bree wanted, so Bree got huffy at the challenge to her "authoritah" and demanded Superintendent Susan Enfield fire Floe. Enfield only listened to Bree's side of the story, too hastily supporting Bree in the firing, then got this fiasco.

Total speculation on my part, but that sounds like the most plausible scenario given what we know so far. What a total mess this is.
Anonymous said…
That would fit with Enfield's habit of listening only to (central) staff, to hell with facts, fairness, or parents sentiments.

Mr. Ed
Anonymous said…
SPS said that score data " was not the only factor," indicating that it was, in fact, a factor. Here's the actual statement:


Unless I'm misunderstanding their doublespeak?

--Beacon Hill Mom
In my humble opinion said…
Amazing how people "have heard" what happened. Taking no position either way, assuming anything just breeds ill will. While people should be supportive, assuming and speculating could also be perceived as damaging to Mr. Floe in some people's eyes.

Until there is direct information from Mr. Floe, Bree Dusseault, or Dr. Susan Enfield we will not actually know what was the cause.

By law, Mr. Floe is the only one who can speak to what happened. It's a good thing that there is such an employment law or all of us employees could be unjustly smeared by employers.

If he was wronged, he should seek legal counsel and pursue damages from the district.
David said…
Hey, "IMHO", you are entitled to your lovely little opinion that everyone else should shut up, but everyone else is free to ignore you. The district fired a popular principal with no explanation. That people are trying to guess what happened should not surprise anyone. And if speculating leads to anger and ill will, who's fault is that? The people who are trying to figure out what happened? Or the people who created this fiasco?
IMHO, that may be true. But as I said, the district can't just fire a respected principal who was undertaking a new program at his school (and parents were enrolling, at least in part, because of his steady leadership) and expect no one will ask questions.

Sure speculation may not help but the district's own PR is to blame for some of that.
Anonymous said…
Well, Mr. Treat can't act as a lawyer for the district while taking on an administration position. Last I heard, they moved the district's HR lawyer to a different position because she made the almighty mistake of displeasing MGJ and her (already gone) HR flunky from Chicago by being honest with them. I don't think they have just a PR problem, me thinks they have a whole host of legal problems defending this one ...

Get a Life said…
Holy cow. This blog is so... Of course the super can't say why she fired someone, he could sue. He is free to say whatever. The racist comment by David - "authoritah" incredible. And if anyone looked carefully for student comments on Floe, one would find that he was seen as a real jerk by many kids at the school.

Can't believe this blog sometimes.
David said…
"Get a Life", hello, it's a reference to the cartoon South Park. Let me Google that for you:


Nice to immediately leap to accusations of racism. Trying to shut down discussion again, very nice.
Nancy C said…
I have a question. I was at the meeting with HMM and there was a good show of support for Mr. Floe. HMM (almost) acceeded to requests to inform Michael DeBell that his consituents were interested in having an executive meeting of the board called with the intent of slowing down the process of placing an interim principal in order to let the possible appeal proceed and to minimize changes at Ingraham while Floe and the district are sorting out their differences. (others feel free to correct me).

My question is this - what is a PIP? I believe I am speaking of a new system for informing an SPS employee that they are "performing unsatisfactorily" and requiring remediation. It has been my experience (albeit brief and poorly informed) that these "plans" are onerous and I wonder if they are (can be/often are) - as some suggest - a set-up for failure. Is there anyone (I think only the union people would be in a position to speak credibly about more than a single case) who can speak to the new remediation plans and how they are being used?

note - placed under this heading because what we need is transparency, transparency, transparency from the district - or we will spend all our blog time discussing the latest in informed (or not) theories. The vacuum of genuine information will always be filled.
David said…
"Get a Life", hello, that is a reference to the cartoon South Park. Let me Google that for you:


Nice to immediately toss out accusations of racism. Still trying to shut down discussion, very nice.
monkeypuzzled said…
Get A Life, the "respect my authoritah" line is from South Park.
It's one of those "meme" things the kids like so much. "Racist"? Um, OK. Bree Dusseault is white. On her similarity to Cartman, I will venture no opinion.

I just hate to see accusations of racism bandied about casually particularly when the integrity of a South Park episode is at stake.
Anonymous said…
Faye chess prentiss was the hr lawyer. Now she does special education. From the comment above I gather this is a punishment placement???? Sped families would agree with that.

Pot calling the Kettle said…
Apologies for my racist call. I need to watch more South Park. I guess Bree is really a more of a southern cracker as she turns out to white, a charter school researcher and teacher performance advocate. Thanks for the heads up.
"The racist comment by David - "authoritah" incredible."

HOw is that racist? Isn't it from South Park?

And you are right about the kids; I've heard varying comments.

The issue is not just Floe; it's how the district handles principals. Every single parent in the district knows their principal can be moved (see Coe) or fired (see Ingraham) or whatever. There is not coherency to placement or to who gets to give input on their new principal.
mirmac1 said…
dear Pot,

No prob'! As a "person of color" who gets sick of elitist "Harvahrd" experts telling me what's good for me, let's all bone up on where's the money's at. Gates wasn't out closing the achievement gap when he was a socially ignorant member of the privileged class.
Anonymous said…

Punishment placement or an effort to drive her to voluntarily quitting. Either way, bad choice for special education (who needs a lawyer who knows the area in a serious way) and looking to be a bad choice when it comes to someone giving truth to power advice on HR issues like firing principals.

But maybe Ron English can fix it ... snark.

In my humble opnion. said…
It is unfortunate that you must take an attacking tone to someone else's opinion. I never said that people shouldn't state their opinion, however that people should not spew 2nd, 3rd, or 4th hand information. You might consider NOT ASSUMING what people mean past what they have written.

Just as people may write positively about how they feel about Mr. Floe, without a doubt there are the voiceless people, who may not follow this blog, or maybe have other things they're more concerned about in day to day survival to write negative comments about Mr. Floe. They also probably figure if they did they'd be "blasted" on this blog just like you did to me.

If people disagree with the majority of commenters, it never fails that they get attacked.
nancy said…
On another note - I was at the meeting with HMM this morning and came away with a couple of questions.
First – I thought there was a good show of support for Mr. Floe and I think HMM got the message that the IHS community is unhappy with the district and Bree Dessault and Enfield specifically.

Second, (I think) HMM committed to letting Michael DeBell know that his constituency would like for him to call an executive session of the school board in order to slow down the process of appointing an interim principal and allowing Mr. Floe to stay in position while his differences with SPS are appealed and brought to a conclusion.

I was not convinced that HMM felt that an executive board meeting should be called.

My question: What is a PIP? Is this the right acronym for the “remediation plans” that the district has recently started using in order to evaluate, remediate and failing this, fire “unsatisfactory” employees? It appears, from my admittedly brief and under-informed experience with this that they have the potential to be used to “set-up” someone for dismissal if the requirements set up under the plan are unreasonably onerous. Is there anyone that can speak knowledgably about how the district is using these plans? I would suspect that only someone with HR knowledge inside the union would have more than a single case to go on, but if the district is using this new tool to rid themselves of employees arbitrarily, that is worrying. I’ve had my differences with the union, but if they see a pattern of unrealistic demands being placed on individual employees, can/will they step up and say something? For that matter who can they discuss this with if the district is the party making those demands?

The information vacuum created by the district will be filled by endless speculation until they start being more open and honest.
Anonymous said…

Faye Chess Prentiss speaking truth to power, what a thought. Let's not forget that this current punishment placement sped attorney and the current head of SPS Legal participate in the same department culture that allowed Ronnie Bryant, convicted felon, to do many disservices to 504 families in this district. I really hoped that Susan Enfield would clean that house.

Anonymous said…
@Get a Life...I believe that was a South Park (Cartman) reference by David, not a racist remark.

IMHO is correct, but the way this was done guarantees speculation, guesses and gossip.

I want this story to stay in the news; I plan to write to the major news outlets to encourage continued coverage.

My kids are in private school now (due to similar reasons as noted by ArchStanton, as well as the dismal Everyday Math), but we were looking at Ingraham for high school, hence my concern on this issue.

signed, Not an SPS parent anymore
Pot, no name calling. While we might not think Ms.Dusseault's credentials are great, please do not call her names.
Anonymous said…

Wasn't writting about Ms. Chess Prentice. I don't think the new HR attorney (who has been with the legal office forever) is capable of speaking truth to power. His reputation is summed up with one word, "timid." Maybe I am wrong, but how things are playing out with Mr. Floe and Mr. Howard makes me think that some needed checks are missing.

Chris S. said…
Excellent turnout and excellent articulation of the issues at Sherry Carr's meeting too, although I was only there for a short time. Sherry was gracious and taking copious notes; I hope she takes this seriously.
Steve said…
Nancy, a PIP is a "Performance Improvement Plan," at least in my experience in the corporate environment. A low-performer is given a plan for improvement, and if the plan isn't followed (usually very closely) and the employee does what they've been asked to do, there is clearer cause for termination. In my experience, PIPs are pretty problematic; they are either written with failure as a near certainty, or even when they are followed to the letter, there is still a termination. Someone with HR experience may say it's a tool to improve performance, but in my experience, it's where employees go to become ex-employees.
Anonymous said…
All schools looking to hire principals -- good luck. The pool is not exactly overflowing with experienced candidates. THey are educationally qualified and freshly launched from a variety of Danforth-esque programs, but no work experience. Green, green, green - few if any w/ actual experience in being a principal (unless you count their internships).

A friend says qualified principal candidates avoid Seattle b/c of pay (not sure that's the case b/c they make over $100K) and b/c of SPS admin.

Newbie principals, mostly newbie Ed Directors, newbie admin, ever changing staff at HQ... doesn't instill too much faith.

Anonymous said…
How does a green principal, with fewer years in the classroom than any of the people she/he is supervising, get the respect and cooperation of the teachers?

We have a green principal, and I don't think it's working too well.

I have no problem with "Eat, Pray, Teach" people who do other things then "find themselves" thorough teaching. They probably have a lot to offer the students. But I don't think "Eat, Pray, Run a School" is a good idea. Principals should be brilliant teachers first. And that takes years in the classroom.

Anonymous said…
"And if anyone looked carefully for student comments on Floe, one would find that he was seen as a real jerk by many kids at the school."

I have looked carefully at the student comments - where did you see these? My kids and their friends really love him - I'm just wondering.....

Of course, every principal is likely to have some detractors among the students, but it seems to me that Floe's popularity is FAR higher than any other principal my children have had...and they have had many over the years.....

signed, Pro Floe!
Chris S. Don't get your hopes up,
Carr has a record of showing interest
and doing nothing. We voted for her
but she has worked hard to loose our
trust; on so many issues she provides
a superficial level of interest and
then consider the case closed. I
guess it makes her job a little
easier to pretend she cares.
LXN said…
Very true about Director Carr. She always looks interested and concerned but never any follow through. I will be voting for Kate Martin. At least she has integrity.

I hope all four of the directors who are running will be ousted. They have always been directed by central office instead of directing.
mirmac1 said…
Concerned SPSParent,

Remember, vote for Kate Martin in your district. There IS an alternative.
dan dempsey said…

Let us examine the situation:

Ingraham's test scores hit a peak in 2005-06, a year after Floe became principal, and since then have declined. Just like the entire school district ... and here is why that occurred.

Check the facts. Prior to the 2005-2006 school year every student in high school for two years took the 10th grade WASL in the spring.

In Spring 2006 the SPS changed the game and only allowed students with sophomore credits to take the WASL. This produced a huge bump up for most SPS HS 10th grade scores.

The SPS math scores went up by almost 15% from Spring 2005 to Spring 2006.
Pass rate 2005 = 40.8%
Pass rate 2006 = 55.7%
Pass rate 2007 = 50.2%

This 55.7% was the highest score ever achieved in the District as by the following year some of those credit deficient two year students were now after three years in high school .. students with sophomore credits and were tested.

District wide number of students tested
Spring 2005 10th grade WASL = 3,510
Spring 2006 WASL # Tested = 2,545

Spring 2007 WASL # Tested = 2,950
Spring 2008 WASL # Tested = 2,921
Spring 2009 WASL # Tested = 2,578
Spring 2010 WASL # Tested = 2,924

District reading scores WASL Pass rates:
Pass rate 2005 = 66.9%
Pass rate 2006 = 82.4%
Pass rate 2007 = 77.7%

Note when the number of students tested declined by almost 30% from 2005 to 2006... the restricting of likely the lowest performing students produced an abnormally high pass rate. (Which the Superintendent has chosen as the initial point to select to show subsequent Ingraham decline).

Note if Dr. Enfield does not like what happened at Ingraham during this time, why is she neglecting the following... (??)

District math pass rate 2006 = 55.7%
District math pass rate 2010 = 45.3%
District bought new books for $800,000 and spent $400,000 on professional development for math teachers to produce those 2010 math pass rates.

Let us take a look at Black Student performance change from Spring 2009 to Spring 2010 and see what a $1.2 million dollar math expenditure produced after the first year.

Pass Rate 2009 = 16.3%
Pass Rate 2010 = 12.5%

Level 1 + no scores in 2009
# of students = 428 => 68.5%

Level 1 + no scores in 2010
# of students = 472 => 68.8%


To get improved results requires attention to improving results. It is most ironic at the same time that the Superintendent is firing Mr. Floe that she is introducing a replacement for the Promotion/ Non-promotion policy that does not even mention interventions for struggling students. The Homework policy replacement she is recommending will be equally ineffective. Both of these will be voted on Wed May 18 at the School Board meeting.
dan dempsey said…
Here is the full scoop on test data for the SPS and Ingraham. Note that it is important to look at the percentage of the population in various subgroups over time. .. Based on mean scores of groups in Seattle you will find...

The Three really important subgroups to observe are Whites because they score much higher than other subgroups. Black Students and Students eligilble for Free and Reduced Meals. These are three important groups to monitor.

The facts about District OSPI annual testing:
Females score higher than Males in grade 10
in Reading and Writing
Females score about the same as Males in math and Science.

The male population at Ingraham increased by 4% from 2005-6 to 2009-10 (this would lower scores)

In the SPS in Math Free and Reduced Meals students score significantly lower than non-Free meal students.

The Free and reduced meal students increased by 13.10% from 2005-6 to 2009-10 (this would lower scores substantially)

The ethic subgroups mean scores are as follows:
Highest => White
Asian/ Pacific Islander
American Indian
Lowest => Black

Ingraham Demographics 2005-06 to 2009-10:
population change
-5.50% White (pop. decrease lowers scores)

-2.80% Asian/Pacific (lowers scores)
+0.20% American Indian
+2.10% Hispanic (lowers scores)
+6.00% Black (pop. increase lowers scores)

Ingraham Demographics 2005-06: 2009-10: in spite of these changes in population demographics, the extended graduation rate at Ingraham changed very little
dropping by 1.10% from 2006 to 2009
from 72.5% to 71.4%
(this is the rate for graduation within 5 years of high school entry).

SPS District Spring 2009 Math pass rate followed by 2010 Math pass rates by ethnic group:

69.9% 68.1% White
53.4% 50.4% Asian/Pacific
29.0% 29.4% American Indian
30.4% 24.2% Hispanic
16.3% 12.5% Black

CHANGE from SPS District Spring 2009 Math pass rate to 2010 Math pass rates by ethnic group:

-1.8% White
-3.0% Asian/Pacific
+0.4% American Indian
-6.2% Hispanic
-3.8% Black
(continued below)
dan dempsey said…
I should have put the above two comments in reverse order.
dan dempsey said…
Why the SPS will never get ahead.....

because to improve a system requires the intelligent application of relevant data.


For the Chicken to cross the road ... the chicken needs to be able to find the road and move forward ....
wsnorth said…
How can SPS central admin mess up everything they do so completely? It seems like - just by pure random chance, if nothing else - they'd be able to do something right!
dan dempsey said…
So I agree if decisions were random that occasionally the Central Admin would get something right, but the Central Admin does not.

Clearly there is a horrible defective plan in place that is being followed. This completely defective plan is certainly being followed carefully.

It seems that in the Floe firing ... the plan is that Autocratic Centralized decision making is best. Down with democratic republics all hail fascism.
Tired of MGJ's henchmen said…
Keep in mind we are still dealing with MGJ's hires--Bree and Enfield. When we elect new board members, oust all of MGJ's hench-men, we will see a new day for SPS.

Who are the 4 board members up for election?

Bree deserves all of the criticsim she can get. She is the most thoughless, shallow, self-serving, vain person I have ever met.
cdubs said…
After reading Danny Westneat's story about Garfield having to cut AP classes after Ted Howard got the approval to create a spanish class, for a few select students, I'm wondering why Enfield's attention isn't on why that class was approved, and by whom. Someone should be FIRED for being so fiscally irresponsible in a cash strapped district.

I agree with you Dan,that there definitely seems to be a concerted effort to follow a plan that is extremely defective.
Anonymous said…
How does it save money to discontinue a class that you can fill unless you are shortening the school day? If those students are going to take another class for their 6th period how is it cheaper to make them take photography instead of AP Spanish? You still have to pay a teacher for that period. I understand that if the class doesn't fill that it is more expensive. But Danny Westneat said that there were several sections of kids who wanted the class.

high school parent
Anonymous said…
The Floe firing seems so politic- ally likely because he was fired outright and not reassigned to another building.

To me, this indicates the power that Bree has downtown and/or her in-cahootness with Enfield, plus the sheer incompetence and lack of judgment on the part of Enfield.

Once again, Betty Patu has shown wisdom and the ability to see through lipstick and mirrors. Ms. Patu needs to become the litmus test from now on.

Fed up with Corporate-Appearing Facades (and this includes the rest of the school board, too)
a-rw said…
Re: Dan's figures on pass rates for Black students

12.5% pass rate district wide???

If Ingraham's test scores were raised to the level of the district, that would still be abysmal! The district is doing something wrong.

Scapegoating a principal might look like doing something but honestly, it just pulls attention away from the other 87.5 percent of Black students districtwide. It's time for a district-wide conversation on what's going wrong here.

No excuses. Accountability starts at the top.
Dorothy Neville said…
Someone mentioned union, but in this case we are talking PASS. Does anyone have the PASS contract, which was approved only in January or so?

My very vague understanding is that the PASS contract has something about evaluating principals with test scores, but that an algorithm for computing this was negotiated and only agreed upon in April. I have not seen any press on the algorithm or the actual PASS contract.
true said…
Try looking at the miserable math programs adopted by the district. The 40 percent of white kids passing are passing becuase they get tutored in math at home. The lower income black kids do not hav that luxury. And try looking at the data from the pov of money instead of race and lo and behold,you have your answer--the poor kids are the ones not passing, black students with income are the 11 percent passing.
Nick said…
Random decisions would improve decision making downtown; so would random appointment of administrators. The heart of the problem is the salaries paid, and the type of person these salaries attract.
KG said…
The District will never succeed because they spend over 9% of the
total budget on Central Administration and keep 18 million a year from going directly to the classroom. This has been going on since about 1995 or so. All other Districts spend about 6% of their budget or less. If you do not believe, me go look at the OSPI reports. This number has cost the students over this 16 year time span more than 200 million dollars of needed classroom value. This new administration will not do anything to stop this but continue more of the same. Out with the School Board and interim Superintendent. They are a JOKE.

This District has the most spent per child on Central admin. by far
and are the most in-efficient in U.S. history.
KG said…

The District is going to give principals up to 10K bonuses based on school acheivement.

As if they do not get paid well as it is.
"She is the most thoughless, shallow, self-serving, vain person I have ever met."

Last chance - NO MORE name-calling. Call her out on her qualifications or her job performance (if you know enough to make a judgment) but no name-calling.

Next time, I delete your comment.

A-RW, you're right. The low pass rate has got to be addressed. Charlie and I have long said that district mandated interventions (not piecemeal school-based ones) need to happen. I again point to the success that Everett and Tukwila have had with their graduation rates when they brought in direct interventions.
Noam said…
We could only wish, Arch.

But, Martin Floe?

Why can't they pick the truly inept and/or dictatorial ones?

I've never heard a bed thing about Martin from anyone who has worked in his school.

This sounds like a Tolley (MGJ) job as it makes no sense, senior staff are not telling the truth and it is taking a real cover-up to hide the real motivations.

Those are all "ingredients" in all of Tolley's "dishes".

He is the one we would be better off losing. Maybe he can get on in Newark.
anonymous said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
Inside as well said…
Hey Anonymous

"they moved the district's HR lawyer to a different position because she made the almighty mistake of displeasing MGJ"

You don't know what you are talking about.

The "lawyer" you are talking about is absolutely incompetant and (on the contrary) served MGJ to the end.

Her record is clear, she sought to cover up everything MGJ wanted covered until some issues got "out of hand" and really made the board realize how few admirable "clothes" the "Emperess" actually had and started looking at MGJ with eyes open.

It did'nt just start with her paralegal getting caught selling crack. The thought of the person who employed him serving as interim HR Director made a lot of sense for SSD. But not so much for other employees.

How that lawyer even still has a job is amazing. She should be working with the former deputy counsel that was fired by Ikeda and later lost her license.

She has brought a lot of her friends and former associates from the county to "feed" at the public "trough" by enjoying huge fees for losing simple cases because she can't handle anything more complicated than the telephone.

Anyone know any accomplishments by the lawyer in question?
anonymous said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
anonymous said…
Melissa you are right in that we NEED district mandated intervention. But I doubt we will see that happen anytime soon in SPS. Actions by the district have made it clear time and time again that they have no intention whatsoever of supporting their struggling students. That's not to say schools aren't supporting struggling students on their own - in fact in sounds like Principal Floe was doing just that. But intervention is not district mandated, district funded, or even district supported.

In the last 5 years:

SPS cut all high school college and career counselors, and they are now cutting elementary counselors.

They closed John Marshall, safety net school.

They are considering closing both of the middle college safety net schools next year.

They cut summer school and night school effective immediately. And now offer no credit retrieval option whatsoever (though I think they are working on offering something, but who knows what, if anything, that will pan out to be??).

At the same time that support services are being cut SPS has begun mandating AP classes for all in many of our high schools - without support for the struggling students who can't pass their regular grade level classes.

When you add that all up, you get the picture of a district that is doing next to nothing for struggling students. A district that one might even think would like struggling students to just drop out and go away already.
Unapologetic Name-Caller said…
"She is the most thoughless, shallow, self-serving, vain person I have ever met."

Okay, let me justify my name-calling with facts:

"Thoughtless"--Bree has arranged 4 meetings at our school that she has failed to show up for. I have made special, after-school arrangements for my kids so I could attend these meetings and she failed to show without apology. Can I therefore call her thoughtless?

"Vain"--The very first thing Bree told our school staff was that she single-handedly saved the New Orleans schools after the flood bringing up graduation rates to 99 percent (a deceptive number given that it was a charter school where those failing were expelled before graduation).

"Self-Serving"--it has been suggested by Ingraham staff that she is using the firing of Floe to promote her own agenda.

Okay, I take it back, she is not "shallow" as I cannot think of any specific examples to show this except, of course, perhaps, that a person who can fire a principal who has 7 years of stellar performance reviews can lose his job in 4 months might loosely be considered shallow.

Can other teachers on this blog support me on this before my post gets deleted for name-calling? What is your experience of Bree?

Thank you
sharpeas said…
There's now a Petition to reinstate Martin Floe. Just follow the link and add your signature. Feel free to forward this to anyone else who may wish to show their support.


Sharon Dickinson
Petition link doesn't work said…
I just tried this petition link and nothing happened.
Anonymous said…
@Petition link doesn't work:

the link is incomplete. Add the 'e' to the end of Mr. Floe's name and it works.

@Name-calling: Failing to show up for a meeting for which parents have had to make special arrangements and failing to apologize for it is truly thoughtless.

Thank you Danny Westneat for hitting the issues hard. He'll get a letter from me today.


No longer an SPS parent
Anonymous said…
"Inside as well,"

Gary Ikeda didn't fire anyone. Brenda Little quit when he got the job instead of her, on his first day. Let's not give Mr. Ikeda credit for something he didn't do. From what I saw and now have read, he didn't do much for his whole time at the district other than nod his head and try very hard to look busy.

If Faye Chess Prentice is so inept, why wasn't she fired? Lawyers are at will, no union rights at all. Easiest people in the district to fire. I am guessing that she has documents to prove her side of things, and that is why she just got moved rather than let go. Not like that has benifited anyone, esp special ed. Watching the activies of the legal office in the last year is painful. If you are on the inside, ask a principal or two about how they feel about the legal office. From what I hear, they skip calling the lawyers and just call the legal assistants now or try to take care of it themselves.

Also on the inside.
wseadawg said…
Unapologetic: I appreciate you weighing in with facts. Facts can change minds; name calling rarely does. Once you have the facts established, however, you are entitled to opine and name-call all you want. However, as I wrote on another post, more and more people are reading this blog all the time, including the local press, because they know the Times & SPS are in cahoots and that the "reporting" from the times, has primarily been stenography vs. journalism over the past few years.

All part of the Ed Reform propaganda apparatus, which rivals a certain political party for staying on message, despite failure after failure.

We can do better and pull the lid off the scams & coup d'etats while we're at it. And that's what this whole TFA in bed with the UW in bed with Astro-Turf groups like Stand for Children etc. ultimately comes down to: Do we, the public, own and have a right to how our schools are run? Or shall we become merely "consumers" in the marketplace, which has worked so well in privatizing healthcare, electricity, water, etc., etc.?

We have the facts and the truth on our side. Let's use them both to hold our ground and protect our kids.
Name said…
Melissa Westbrook said...

"Last chance - NO MORE name-calling. Call her out on her qualifications or her job performance (if you know enough to make a judgment) but no name-calling."

Then why does Charlie get to call her a liar in the title of another thread?
Name said…
Sorry, should clarify that Charlie is calling Enfield a liar not Bree. Terrible pronoun abuse on my part.
Anonymous said…
@Name -- because the headline is backed up by a post explaining how she is lying. I'm glad the Unapologetic Name Caller backed up what he said -- that was enlightening to this reader, who hadn't heard of BD before Floe was fired.

--Faithful SSS Reader
Kristin Bailey-Fogarty said…
Name-caller, you're my colleague, albeit one hiding behind anonymity, but you are not supporting your name calling with facts.

""Thoughtless"--Bree has arranged 4 meetings at our school that she has failed to show up for. I have made special, after-school arrangements for my kids so I could attend these meetings and she failed to show without apology. Can I therefore call her thoughtless?" ---- I know of two dates that were emailed as options for a meeting with staff. There was one meeting. I do not remember a second meeting where Bree was a no-show, unless this was a one-on-one meeting you scheduled.

""Vain"--The very first thing Bree told our school staff was that she single-handedly saved the New Orleans schools after the flood bringing up graduation rates to 99 percent (a deceptive number given that it was a charter school where those failing were expelled before graduation)." --- This is not true. The very first thing she told us was that she was looking forward to working with us. The quote in question - and you've misquoted her, she never claimed to have done anything single handedly- was in response to a math teacher's question about how could we possibly raise test scores given the low skills our students arrived with. Bree simply said it could be done. Your "fact" that students were expelled before graduation is crazy talk. Back that up, please.

""Self-Serving"--it has been suggested by Ingraham staff that she is using the firing of Floe to promote her own agenda." --- What? Who are you? Since when were suggestions and speculation facts? I hope you're not teaching that to our students.

You can discredit my adjustment of your facts if you want, given that I'm using my real name and there are lots of "facts" out there about me, but please don't represent our staff in such a nasty way. When you do that anonymously, people think you could be anyone who teaches at Ingraham.

Anonymous said…

Was Ingraham Bree's only school?
If not, then how do you know that
this writer is not from one of her
others schools?

Your attempt to defend Bree looks
a bit fishy, by the way, given the
fact that you are in an organ-
ization to get rid of SEA with Bree's husband.

Signed, Thou dost protest too much
MoneyPenny said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
Kristin said…
Thou dost protest -

Fairly done. I did assume it was a colleague from Ingraham. Phew! Good to think Name - caller might be from another staff.

And you're assuming, too. I am in an organization with Bree's husband, but its purpose is not to "get rid of SEA."

Thanks for calling me on it.

MoneyPenny said…
Ms. Bailey-Fogarty,

It is being reported that the IHS voted unanimously to support Mr. Floe. I am curious to ask you if that is correct. I understand that as a friend of Ms. Duesseult's, you are in an interesting position, so if you don't want to answer, that is comepletely fine. I appreciate that you are willing to post under your own name, I ask because whenever folks throw out "complete support" in SPS, I have found that when you look closer, that isn't always the truth.
Kristin said…

I did not sign the resolution.

I was out of the building when the staff met to write it and sign it. It is possible (and probable) that all in attendance signed it.

A teacher but not at Ingraham said…
Kristin, you are not my colleague and I am not an Igraham staff member. Since you support Bree, it is your luxury to use your name. Since I am not supporting Bree and she is already fired Martin Floe for not supporting her, it is not cowardice but a desire to keep my job. Now, I am going to read your post again and respond more thoroughly.
cdubs said…
@ Kristen. Do you support Mr. Floe?
Anonymous said…
I would just caution against giving
the writer named Kristin too much attention. It seems that part of the problem with Bree is that she has been given too much attention with too little to show for it.

The focus is on the fact that a beloved educator has apparently been fired unjustly.

Anyone who would respond to email in such a knee-jerk way as Kristin
just did indicates that she and her cronies, including Bree and husband, are feeling the heat. Let's not allow them to start feeling like victims.

"no sideshows or carnival barkers"
needed (to quote President Obama)
Hoping I haven't put my job in jeopardy said…
I understand that a teacher "leaked" information that hurt Martin Floe. I don't know who this Kirstin is but I plan to google her. My facts are not incorrect and if more teachers had the courage, they would support me.

I need this job to support my kids and it is a recession.

Now I am very scared about my postings getting to Bree. Can the person who created this blog reassure me that what I post is indeed confidential.

I have been warned not to use blogs and internet and we do indeed live in a time of fear and Bree is quite obviously a dictatorial boss.

Am I truely safe posting on here? Is there anyway that my name can be given to Bree?
Kristin said…
A teacher -

Whoa! You think it's easy to use my name when I have 60 colleagues and hundreds of parents and students who don't appreciate that I'm friends with Bree? Really? How do you think my year has been in my building?

Bree can't fire teachers. Only the principal can fire teachers, so by using my name to correct some inaccuracies, I am sticking my neck out. I am not using my name because I'm "safe" to do so, I'm using my name because I think if you have something to say, you own saying it.

cdubs said…
@ wseadawg

"All part of the Ed Reform propaganda apparatus, which rivals a certain political party for staying on message, despite failure after failure."

I agree with your statement. Reform needs to come from the people, for the people, and by the people. Not private institutions, nor organizations. People also need to take into consideration that speaking truth to power is pointless, as the people in power already know the truth. The truth needs to continue to be spoken to the people who can create the change, remove the corruption that, I believe, plagues the Seattle school district. The corruption and cronyism will be far worse if the ed-reform and TfA are allowed to continue to infiltrate the school district.

Just my opinion, and we know what they say about opinions :-)
Untoward said…
"Hoping I haven't put my job in jeopardy,"

Are you posting from a district computer? Absent that, your posts should be fine. Does an Ex Director have the ability to impact the employment of a teacher? ABSOLUTELY. Esp if the Ex Dir has taken out the principal and his ultimate replacement knows it. If you are using a district computer to post, then sadly you may find yourself in trouble, esp if you posted during school hours.

Ask the JSCEE staff about Ron English's efforts to find out who was blogging and posting when Pottergate broke.
Name-Caller said…
Kristen, I haven't left the blog yet to figure out who you are, but I am assuming you are a teacher at Ingraham. You are wrong about Bree's power,if she were to ask my principal to put me on a PIP that involved getting a 90 percent Pass rate on the MSP when our school population has never had it, then I would be out of job and the procedure would have been followed. I do feel fortunate that I have a union when (I understand) principals do not. What, exactly, is your issue with Floe? I do not work at your building, so please inform.

Also, I would really like to know how confidential our posts are. I agree that you can't speak truth to power, and I don't know hwo many voters read this blog, I do know that the turn-out for the coffee chats was high and the the current 4 board members up for re-election did not seem all that concerned about convincing us they even cared about Floe, they are backed by business, I wonder how we can reach a broader audience than this blog to make sure the 4 get voted out?
Concerned said…
Thank you, Untoward, no, I never post on district computers during school hours. I wouldn't have the time--even lunch breaks are filled with planning the next lessons. I always post from my home computer. Now I can sleep tonight! I do know more teachers would come forward if they weren't scared about losing their job. And nobody in my building anymore ever communicates through e-mail--it is all in person--the level of fear of losing one's job is higher than it has ever been.

Maybe I just should embrace Bree and Enfield so that I can sleep better at night. If only I didn't have a conscience, it is a curse. My classes actually do score high on these tests and the MAP always places me as a "strong teacher", so why do I care--if only I didn't care about our fellow educators!
cdubs said…
@ Name-Caller.

"I wonder how we can reach a broader audience than this blog to make sure the 4 get voted out?"

Speaking truth to the people has more power then one thinks, and word of mouth, organizing, educating, and exposing those who commit unjust acts is a very strong tool. The more you expose, the more pressure you bring, the more people will respond. I think the this blog has given people a solid foundation to expand on those unjust things, and for that I thank this blog.
I have a feeling that there are many innovative minds that can continue to grow, develop, and evolve this movement that seeks only what is best for the students of the Seattle school district. Who better to create that change then the people.

Again, thank you for this blog as it has given a voice to many who had no voice, and the voices will get louder until those in power understand that they too, are replaceable.
No, Charlie called Dr. Enfield a liar (unless I missed something). He explains why he believes this.

Kristen, you should at least identify yourself as a former TFA. I say that only because TFA is quite a clannish group.

No, Bree cannot fire teachers or principals but it certainly is within her power to tell the Superintendent information about what she sees at schools. That, in turn, informs the Superintendent's decision. I very much believe Bree had much to do with the decision to fire Martin Floe. I also suspect that any other Ex Director might not have come down so harshly, for example, Phil Brockman.

Hoping, I don't even know who you are. Even if I did, I would never disclose it to anyone in the district (unless I suspected you did something criminal).

In terms of the fall elections, I'm sure many others, outside this blog, are working hard, even as we write here, to find and support candidates to win. Each of us is key.

You MUST be willing to speak up to relatives, friends and neighbors. You MUST be willing to go door-to-door, neighbor-to-neighbor even if it's just your block. You must be willing to chat up parents on the playground in the fall. And yes, it would be nice if you could donate $10-20 to a candidate.

These elections are NOT won on money (see the Gates' numerous failures at the ballot box) but money always helps. Even if just one Board member changes, it would help.

It's not much to ask if we want a better run, more coherent, more "our district, not their district" district.
Hoping said…
Please let me know who is running against the 4 board members up for re-election and I will donate $20 to each. I have already told my mom (who lives in Carr's district) to vote her out. I have no other family members (nor myself) who live in the districts with board members running. I don't know if it is my place to tell parents to vote board members out but I certainly can let them know where the board stands and let them make the decision. I do know that on Friday, parents were all the buzz about Floe being fired and were angry about it and very, very anti-Enfield. And these are parents in Carr's district who are not in the Ingraham neighborhood. This Floe-firing has created a stronger reaction among the parents I work with than MGJ's mismanagement of money. There were still sympathetic parents to MGJ, but not a single parent is sympathetic to Enfield. The firing of Floe is very, very damaging to Enfield. I hope Enfield does some damage control and considers putting Bree on a PIP. Thank you for keeping me anonymous and I assure you I (unlike those above me) have not commited any criminal acts--no mismanagement of funds, no unjust firings, no adoption of bad math curriculums (which is truly criminal!)....
Kristin said…
I'm not TFA. I thought you knew that.

I attended the TEP program at the UW. I student taught in Lake Washington, where I taught until 2007, and then came to Seattle.


Kristin said…
Oops, not that it matters, and not that I should share so much here, but I hate misinformation.

I left LW in 2002 and then came to Seattle.
Peter Schurke, Ingraham Teacher said…
I am a colleague of Kristin's at Ingraham High School.

I have never talked politics with her. I have never asked her about who she hangs out with and who her friends are. None of that matters to me.

She is extremely courageous to put herself out there and attempt to correct facts as she sees them. Especially because she was attempting to correct negative perceptions about a figure that has been tarred and feathered already on this blog. It's easy to roll with the tide...it takes considerably more courage to try to swim against it.

Kristin never said in any of her posts (as far as I could see) that she did or did not support Mr. Floe. She said she was out of the building and did not have the opportunity to sign the resolution. Assumptions that she does not support him are just that--Assumptions.

I am stepping up to say that my colleague Krisin Bailey is as honorable and principled a teacher as I have ever had the pleasure to work with. I would (and have) place my trust in her hands without reservation. I know from personal experience that her discretion is above reproach.

Unless you've picked up a notebook and worked in a classroom with her, you have no idea who she is. Please keep your speculation and character assassination to yourself.

(And no...the transitive property of friendships does not apply. Just because I am willing to speak up about the high character of my friend and colleague Kristin does not mean that I have any stance whatsoever about her friend Ms. Dusseault. I barely know Ms. Dusseault and have had no more than one or two interactions with her. Until I have enough data to form an opinion, I choose to have no opinion about Ms. Dusseault at this time.)
suep. said…
Bailey-Fogarty teaches at Ingraham and also has connections to the League of Education Voters (she said on an earlier post, which was deleted when Blogger went down, that she is a member of LEV's board).

Here is a recent post she wrote for LEV's site about teacher evaluations:


(LEV is a Hanauer and Gates-funded corporate ed reform enterprise.)

p.s. It's Dusseault's husband who is TFA.

p.p.s. -- Kristin, if you had been in the building, would you have signed the resolution in support of Floe?

Anonymous said…
Time for a repeat of a previous

I would just caution against giving
the writer named Kristin too much attention. It seems that part of the problem with Bree is that she has been given too much attention with too little to show for it.

The focus is on the fact that a beloved educator has apparently been fired unjustly.

Anyone who would respond to email in such a knee-jerk way as Kristin
just did indicates that she and her cronies, including Bree and husband, are feeling the heat. Let's not allow them to start feeling like victims.

"no sideshows or carnival barkers"
needed (to quote President Obama)
High-School LA Teacher said…
I'm pleased that Kirsten is reading this blog and reporting it to Bree. Maybe Bree can learn and grow. Is it naive to assume that?

Please tell Bree that if she wants the support of the principals, teachers, and parents in her region, she is not going to earn it by swooping in, firing our colleagues within the first 10 months of her leadership, threatening to fire other much loved colleagues if they don't bring the test scores up, and introducing herself to staff using cutsie, juvenile slogans (example: I believe you can shoot any student to the stars; if you think you can, you can; all you have to do is believe)slogans one finds on those posters 5 year olds put in their room with kittens featured. I think there is a little more than just believing involved!

You have no power to fire the people actually educating our children, those ultimalely and only capable of changing education, we teachers. Even if you fire every principal there is in your region, you still will not be able to get to us. This is Seattle, not the South or Chicago where that is done.

If you want to change education, you will have to do it with us not against us.

You should have worked with Floe. He didnt' have a chance. You only gave him 4 months to improve after he had 7 years of stellar evaluations. You didn't even wait until Ingraham's current MSP scores posted in August. And there will be egg on your face because, from what I am hearing, the MSP scores for Ingraham are predicted to be higher than they have ever been.

Doing this is not going to win us over. You managed to make Floe a hero, there is now talk that he should run for school board, wouldnt' that be ironic if he won.

Kirsten, thank you for conveying this message to Bree.

Kirsten, you have yet to say one thing that Floe did to deserve this. What have you got against Floe? You are the only one who apparently works at Ingraham on this blog. WHY FIRE FLOE?

Was this a ploy to put TFAers in at Ingraham? Some have speculated this? You will not be able to replace certified teachers with cheaper TFAers. As a parent, I am glad of this, I would not want some summer-trained teacher teaching my child.

So let me tell you what I have heard from teacher friends in other schools--you have been compared to many fictional villains, your name has been slandered, teachers play with variations of your name to come up with the most unappealing, I won't mention it on this blog, no name-calling. But don't you think, Kirsten, that Bree would want to know that not only has she not won over her staff but that they are speaking ill of her? And there is not a single staff member at my school who has anyting positive to say about Bree (and we loved the former Ex.Dir.) and at my wife's school, it is even worse--she is the butt of jokes.

I'm not reporting this to be mean. IF Bree is going to criticize Floe for not being a strong leader, she needs to hold the mirror up to herself. Being extremely unpopular among teachers (and this was before Floe was fired) is also not the mark of a strong leader.
RosieReader said…
Kristin, I think any problems you've had this year have more to do with your decision to blog about a coworker in a pretty unflattering way.
dan dempsey said…
a-rw said..

Re: Dan's figures on pass rates for Black students

12.5% pass rate district wide???

If Ingraham's test scores were raised to the level of the district, that would still be abysmal! The district is doing something wrong.


Here is what the District is doing wrong in Math.

(1) Failing to use known effective practices and materials for instruction.

(2) Using among the worst instructional methodologies and materials available.

The above plan is regularly followed as "evidence" of what works and what does not in regularly disregarded by the Central Administration and four school directors.... Carr, Sundquist, Martin-Morris, Maier.

The largest study in education history addressed what educationally disadvantaged learners need to succeed in grades k through 3. The District plans are in direct contradiction to what is known to work for these students.

John Hattie in his incredible book "Visible Learning" analyzes the results of 800 meta studies involving millions of students world wide. Again the district is following a plan to do what has been proven to fail.

In March 2008 the National Math Advisory Panel released its final report "Foundations for Success". On page xxiii paragraph 27 the report revealed exactly what has been proven to be successful for struggling students..... again the District ignores the relevant information in NMAP and continues with a failing plan.

It is NOT an accident that the Black math pass rate is 12.5% at grade 10 ..... That result is a direct result of following a plan that will produce that result.

In 2007 SPS and Bethel adopted Everyday math.
In 2007 Bethel SD adopted "Discovering" for HS
In 2009 SPS adopted "Discovering" for HS

Both Districts have a diverse student population and both Districts are producing poorer results.

Bethel All Students 10th grade pass rates... the last three years are with "Discovering"

2004-05 WASL 39.90%
2005-06 WASL 39.20%
2006-07 WASL 36.10%
2007-08 WASL 35.00%
2008-09 WASL 30.30%
2009-10 HSPE 26.50%

Bethel Black Students 10th grade math pass rates

2004-05 WASL 21.4%
2005-06 WASL 23.3%
2006-07 WASL 26.6%
2007-08 WASL 22.5%
2008-09 WASL 17.6%
2009-10 HSPE 15.8%

Both Bethel and Seattle use
Everyday Math -- elementary
Connected Math Project -- middle
Discovering -- high school

The district is doing something wrong.

The district is doing most everything wrong and by design.
Mom of Latisha said…
I agree with Dan. My daughter (who is black) started school with a better understanding of math than she now has. The Everyday Math curriculum has really screwed up her understanding of math concepts. Luckily, my husband and I are college educated, and have started teaching her math at home. Note, the minute we began teaching her at home, her math scores went up on the MAP. We do have to spend more time than we would if she had had no math at school in order to clear up misconceptions the Everyday Math curriculum has given her. It really is a poor curriculum.
anonymous said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
cdubs said…
@Peter Schurke

To say people are speculating is to insult their intelligence. I've been remotely connected to the Seattle school district for over 20 years, and the answer isn't to privatize the school system as those who are infiltrating the district are attempting to do. All you have to do is have a competent superintendent that will alleviate the good 'ol boy/girl network, get rid of the waste at the administrative level, and fire those who rightfully deserve it. You can start @ Garfield with Ted Howard, or close down Rainier Beach, which is an albatross on the school district budget. Does anyone have any idea why Rainier Beach stays open?
anonymous said…
Kristin thanks for posting here. I know how hard it is to swim upstream on this blog so thanks for holding your ground, and hanging in there! IMHO it's always good to get two sides of the story. Sorry too about the misinformation posted about you being a TFA recruit - where did that info come form anyway Melissa? Another reliable source?

Kristin, what is your take on the situation regarding Floe? Why do you think he was fired? Do you think it was justified, or not? Do you think Bree had anything to do with it? And it so, were her actions justified?
dan dempsey said…
cdubs said:

"Does anyone have any idea why Rainier Beach stays open?"

Check it out ... where do struggling students go to school that actually addresses their needs with meaningful interventions? In the Seattle School District at the high school level .. I have no idea.

I hope Renton is better.

Why is most of the SPS k-12 system directed the way it is?

High poverty schools have huge problems that are ignored by Seattle's leadership.

I shall add your RBHS question to the hundreds I have that are apparently unanswerable.

RBHS with central admin direction has not done better. It should be noted that RBHS math has gone totally in the toilet since UW College of Ed came to help. RBHS had a good acceptance rate of students accepted to the UW this year.... perhaps that would be a good reason to keep it open.

The big question is ... why does k-8 education of students continue the way it has in Seattle Schools?

I would say k-8 education as a whole is defective for struggling students because the Promotion/ Non-promotion policy has been ignored and the District does absolute ZERO in the way of providing effective interventions for struggling students.
Kristen, I believe I got you mixed up with someone else. My apologies.

Peon, no one gets it right all the time. At least I admit my mistakes. I note that when I ask others here about their information, I tend to get dead silence.
Peter Schurke, Ingraham Teacher said…

You misunderstood me, sir/madam. Context is everything. I thought that it was clear from context that I was referring to speculation about Ms. Bailey.

You want to speculate about any topic you want, go right ahead. I have no problem with it.

On the other hand, anybody says something derogatory and that I know to be untrue about one of my colleagues, I'm going to stand up and say something about it.

"First they came for the communists, and I said nothing becuase I was not a communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I said nothing becuase I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the jews, and I said nothing because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me, and there was no-one left to speak for me."

--Pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984)
cdubs said…
@ Kristin, and or Peter. As you've both been on here defending people, I've yet to see either one of you defend Mr. Floe. Do you give him a vote of confidence, or no confidence?
mirmac1 said…

Reading Kristen's "brave" defense of her innocent friend, and Peon's follow-up, I went back to look up an amusing exchange between my friend Dorothy and Ms. Bailey-Fogerty. Dorothy described like this:

"Friday evening I received an email from a teacher at Ingraham, Kristin Bailey-Fogarty, a friend of Bree Dussault and former TfA corps. She cc'd Melissa as blog administrator to let her know that my comment about Bree and Chris was inappropriate on many levels. She called me an idiot. Now, I've been scratching my head to figure out why she would feel the need to do that. And why cc Melissa? Was Kristin feeling threatened? Was her tattling to Melissa trying to get me censored? Was it meant as fear and intimidation?"

Again Peon popped up to back Kristen and Bree Dusseault (thoughtless, shallow, vain, sounds right on to me!) At the time, Peon, you took Dorothy to task with:

"I will also say that I agree with Kristen to a certain extent. If you have issues with Bree that's fine, lay them out, but surely you can find more substance for discussion than how young and in love she is, how much money she spent on her honeymoon, and the fact that she married an SPS math teacher. That is so irrelevant, and does not have anything at all to do with the job she is doing.

How about some substance now. What, if anything, has Bree done to improve Ingraham, or her other schools? How has she gone about doing it? Are teachers and families happy or unhappy with her work thus far? Why, or why not?"

Yes, what, if anything has Bree done to improve Ingraham? Never thought I'd say it but Peon, you may be onto something. How did you know this was going to happen? Spooky!
Chris S. said…
Whether there are one or two Kristi/ens, there was an Ingraham teacher who testified on behalf of TFA at a board meeting, saying (paraphrased) "I don't know why my colleagues are afraid of this competition." So Melissa, if you made a mistake, I'd say it was a pretty honest one.
anonymous said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
anonymous said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
anonymous said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
Peter Schurke, Ingraham Teacher said…

In general, it is in poor form to ask someone how they voted. It's none of your buisness.

For the record, because I have nothing to hide, I proudly signed the resolution of support for Mr. Floe.

This is my final post on this matter. Please do not bother to direct any comments at me, I will not be responding to them.
anonymous said…
Peter is right, in that it is poor form to ask someone how they voted. However since Kristin weighed in so heavily on the topic, in a public forum, I don't think it was so out of line to ask her.
suep. said…
@Peter Schurke

re: the votes for Floe

Actually, I believe the views and politics of the teachers in a school where I may be sending my child are indeed my business.

As for "poor form," I think the district has mastered that particular trait. It gives us parents so little true information about matters that are crucial to the well-being of our kids that we are left digging for it ourselves.

Everything about how the district has treated Floe has been in poor form.

Also, Bailey-Fogarty has been willing to be publicly vocal about her opinion on other matters, so she has invited public scrutiny of her views herself. Her post on LEV's blog about teacher evaluations, for example, in which she intimates that she is the only teacher at Ingraham who aspires to be more than simply "satisfactory" struck me as poor form as well.

It appears there is quite a bit of poor form to go around.

Not everybody liked Floe said…
If you read the comments on the Times article"Principal of Seattle's Ingraham to be replaced" there are a few anti-floe comments and the one from a former student dated May 11 at 3:50 pm is pretty revealing to me.We may never what happened unless Floe wants to talk about it.

Pot calling back
CMM said…
Those fans of Floe far outnumber that one student comment and this one teacher named Kirsten.

Just an aside, if this is the same Kirsten who spoke in favor of TFA, and I hope she is still reading this thread....

Do you really think the object to TFAers has to do with fear of competition? How naive is that. If you pay the TFA teacher the same salary (instead of half of what most teachers make) then I have no objection to having a TFAer in my school (not for my child, though, too little training). This has nothing to do with competition or fear of these two-month trained "teachers". This has everything to do with trying to under-cut our salaries by finding cheaper "teachers". Most TFAers don't stay. They can't live on such a parsley amount. Now ask your friend Bree how much she makes to float from school to school firing principals, and Enfield. MGJ made, what, 280K. And they want to hire teachers who are actually doing the education that this is all about only 22K?

How can you, Kirsten, not be offended by that? Could you live on 22K? What is that, 1,500 a month? That doesn't even pay rent.
One more thing... said…
It is pure propaganda that TFAers are brought in as better teachers. I don't think anyone belives that. You know, Kirsten, they are brought in because they are cheap. And the same group arguing for quality education, ED. Reformers, are showing themselvs to be true hypocrites by spouting quality education on one hand and then finding the cheapest teachers they can on the other hand. This is like saying "peace keepers" to missiles or "No Child LEft Behind" and then withdrawing money from the poor schools that are being left behind. Hypocrites. Quality education with cheap teachers.
anonymous said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
anonymous said…
Actually CMM, TFA recruits cost the district more than regular, traditionally trained, first year teachers cost. By contract, TFA recruits must be paid the same salary as any other first year teacher, and they get the same benefits too (take a look at the contract. However when the district hires a TFA recruit they have to pay a placement fee of several thousand dollars to the TFA organization, so in the end they wind up costing us more than other first year teachers. luckily we have a grant for the placement fee right now, but it will run out eventually.
CMM said…
No, you are wrong, the Gates is paying for the TFA finder's fee and half of the TFA contract. This makes TFA teachers exactly half as cheap as a first year teachers. Havent' you been following this? Look at the School Board minutes for the past year.
CMM said…
I have to go to work. Bye, I will blog when I get home.
Inside as well said…

All administrators are "at will". Think that makes them easy to get rid of? Not hardly.

So is Bill Martin. Notice where he works? Sits in a room and ignores the phone, thats where.

You are right about Brenda quitting. Kinda like MGJ's "resignation". Your idea of a quit I suppose.

I think you are really Brenda because I know of no one else around the district who thinks much of her. Again, what accomplishment has she performed?

Brenda was a better lawyer even with the drug problem. Now you are stuck with Ron English.
anonymous said…
Hmmm, I knew we had a grant that paid the placement fee for TFA recruits in certain (math/science) fields, but I'd not heard we had a grant to pay 1/2 of a TFA recruits salary throughout their contract? Anyone else hear this?
StopTFA said…
TFA'ers are merely another union busting tool wielded by ed reformers and the billionaire boys club. They strut and claim "see, ANYONE can teach (to the test), Look at me!" After their 1-2 years of "service", they run off to join Daddy's firm or whatever. Or they become Executive Directors.
Maureen said…
I don't see anything about TfA CMs being cheaper in the TfA Contract. It says:

B. Compensation of Teachers. Seattle Public Schools shall provide to every Teacher employed by Seattle Public Schools pursuant to this Agreement the same salary and benefits (including, as applicable, health, dental, vision and retirement) as are provided to other teachers employed by Seattle Public Schools who are similarly situated from the standpoint of certification status, seniority and any other factors routinely used by Seattle Public Schools in making such decisions.

(Thanks to Seattle Education for the link.)

Maybe there is something in the agreement The Gates Foundation made with SPS re paying the $4000 annual fee?

In a March 2011 blog post, Melissa quoted this from the Washington STEM Center:

Now I see at the Washington STEM site this information (which appears to be new):

Washington STEM’s investment in Teach For America will fund TFA corps members holding STEM (science, technology, engineering and math) degrees after they have been voluntarily hired by the Puget Sound partner districts to teach math and science secondary level courses or into elementary school positions. Washington STEM funds will be used exclusively for pre-service certification, professional development and other ongoing support for those incoming Teach For America STEM corps members. ....

That implies that salary will not be covered by the grant (and will only cover stated expenses for science and math teachers).

Maybe CMM has access to other sources?
Maureen said…
Aack! I posted a truly beautiful piece (if I do say so myself!) with three links in it that backed up Peon's thought that Gates is paying the fees but not the salaries. It showed up, but now it's gone! I'm not rewriting it (Seattle Education has a link to the TfA contract, Melissa did a post in March that talks about the Gates/WA STEM funding and I linked to WA STEM to back that up.)
Maureen said…
Just a thought. TfA CMs usually do their practice teaching in summer schools in the city they are placed in. How will Seattle TfAers get their (less than five weeks) of classroom time since Seattle has cancelled summer school?

(wv is somerpor, yes it's not a good summer to be poor in Seattle.)
Anonymous said…
Inside as well,

"All administrators are "at will.""

Not correct. Any certificated administrator or ESA holder is on a contract. That means all of the Exec Directors, the Sp Ed Exec Director(s) and Supervisors, the Bilingual staff, and pretty much anyone who is on the Teaching and Learning side of the house isn't at will. Heck, Pegi McEvoy made still have her school nurse ESA. That means that most of the time, absent firing for cause, all of these people could find themselves back at a building before they are fired. But if you are "on the inside," you would know that, since many of the Ed Directors who have been demoted in the past are now at schools.

And if you are "on the inside," well, doesn't that make Ron our problem?

Also on the inside.
TechyMom said…
They are on the same pay scale, but have less experience and less education that many teachers, so they are at the bottom end of the pay scale. Since they typically don't stay in the field very long, they don't move up the pay scale.
Charlie Mas said…
I don't know Ms Bailey-Fogarty. We have never met. Nevertheless, she has done a number of things I admire very much.

She teaches. That, right there, tells me a lot of good things about her.

From her post on the LEV blog I know that she is a thoughtful and caring teacher. That's wonderful.

Also from her post on the LEV blog I know that she is willing to publicly state her perspective even when she knows that many oppose it. That's brave and I give her full credit for it.

Read the blog thread and you will see that Ms Bailey-Fogarty constructively engaged those with an opposing perspective. I value that tremendously. You'll notice that other authors on the LEV blog don't do that. Seriously, this, as much as anything else, recommends her. It is kind and confident.

Then, on top of everything else, Ms Bailey-Fogarty writes in defense of her friend here on this blog. That is so admirable it leaves me grinning stupidly.

She has honestly come by her perspective, she sees the merit in other views, and she can explain why she believes as she does. That's what matters to me, not the conclusion that she eventually draws. I don't have to agree with her to admire her.

There is nothing that anyone can write here that can actually harm another person. Sticks and stones... But it still takes courage to comment here against the tide - and it takes even more to do it without devolving into spiteful acrimony.

I admire Ms Bailey-Fogarty and I hope to continue exchanging thoughts with her for a long time to come.
Anonymous said…
Also "Inside as well,"

Just like I wasn't praising Ms. Chess Prentice, I wasn't saying anything good about Ms. Little. I just don't believe that Mr. Ikeda should get credit for doing anything with respect to her. She'd already quit the day he walked in the door.

Also on the inside.
anonymous said…
I totally agree with Charlie, and thank him for welcoming Kristin to the forum. IMO the most healthy blogs have as many voices, and as many perspectives being shared as possible, respectfully.
cdubs said…
Why does anyone want to privatize public schools when you already have private schools, or you can build your own private school wherever you wish? The business model they're going after is kind of like professional sports. Taxpayers build it, taxpayers fund it, and the company gets the profits.

In my opinion, anything that has tax dollars going to it should have complete and absolute transparency, therefore, there is no need for speculation as to where all the $$$ is going, or has gone.

You know what they say..it doesn't take a...
Jan said…
Thanks, Peon and Charlie -- for coming to Kristen's defense. I am not as dazzled (i.e. -- stupidly grinning) by Kristin as Charlie, partly because those she supports are, in fact, the ones wielding all the power -- and partly because my stupidly grinning dazzledness has been usurped by her colleague, Peter, who stopped me in my tracks with "the transitive property of friendship." I was only beginning to reassemble my critical faculties when I was again undone by the Pastor Martin Niemöller quote.

Ah me. Both of you (Peter and Kristen) overcome an ocean of my despair over the administrative mismanagement of this District. Lucky are we (and lucky is IHS) to have teachers such as you.

And no, I don't think it is appropriate to demand of either of them (although I suppose one could always ask nicely) that they share their opinions of Mr. Floe.

They posted responses -- based on personal knowledge -- to a specific point (Kristen's, in support of Bree; Peter's, in support of Kristen). They demanded nothing of other posters. If they, teachers at the school at the heart of this controversy, feel it most prudent to limit their posts to their main point, and to deal with their opinions, etc., with respect to Mr. Floe in other ways, who am I to gainsay them?
Anonymous said…
Bree is the villan here. She is making it almost impossible to teach at my elementary school. She has to go. Is it true she is moving to the south end?

Northend Teacher
Sara said…
"On Monday, Enfield clarified the role that test scores played in her decision. The school's scores were not a main factor, she said, because she evaluated the person, not the school. But she also said test scores are considered in evaluating principals and that Ingraham's 'underscore the need for strong instructional leadership at the school.'"

Whip lash I tell you. Fired for low scores, no scores had nothing to do with it, okay, well, they did have something to do with it, but not all of it.
Northend Teacher, thanks for chiming in. I was wondering what other teachers/staff in her region thought. You are just one person but I would surely like to hear from others.
mirmac1 said…
Frankly, show me the evaluation tool for Executive Directors? The HR Oversight briefing was illuminating in Central Admin's complete failure to build accountability into their (many) positions. Guess it's only teachers and principals who take the fall, unless you deposit $64K into your personal bank account, ala Potter.
suep. said…
Fresh from the Seattle Times:

More to come | Interim Seattle School Superintendent Susan Enfield announced today that she has reversed her decision to dismiss Ingraham High School Principal Martin Floe.
Not Kirsten's colleague said…
I wonder how Kirsten Bailey-Fogarty is feeling right now?
Anonymous said…
Sara nailed it! Whiplash is right!

Re & whither TFA? 2 years in the classroom = street cred later on, after hopping into the executive ranks.

C'mon people, we're talking about people destined for the bigs. Stay in the classroom? Shyeah! Hright!

Social Entrepeneurialism & Venture Philanthropy: Not a Gift; An investment. (Look it up.)

And the purpose of investing is? Duh! Winning!


Popular posts from this blog

Tuesday Open Thread

Seattle Public Schools and Their Principals

COVID Issues Heating up for Seattle Public Schools