Parent Info about Orchestra Situation in SPS
When I attended a Regional Meeting earlier this fall, I met Keith Bowen and some other parents. They are parents who are concerned about orchestra offerings the follow-thru from middle to high school music especially around the orchestra offerings. I talked with them after the meeting and Keith sent me this article about their concerns which I want to share with you. (I edited this article for length.) If you would like to reach him to join his group or offer ideas, his e-mail is keith@fixbassoon.com
The new Student Assignment Plan (SAP) changes the demographics of who is assigned to which school. However, specialized programs are still in place at these same locations but now the students are distributed without regard to their interests or merit.
Parents, teachers and local administrators predicted the oncoming situation and how it
would affect a prized resource of music education. They predicted that existing programs would come dangerously close to not having enough participants to justify a full time professional educator (125 students). Calculations indicated that schools that thought they were going to have new programs would not receive a critical mass necessary to fill a classroom. Petitions were gathered and presented to the administration. Emails poured into the suggestion site. Meetings were attended. The school board was addressed. Individual meetings with board members were arranged and parents met regularly to discuss ways to be heard by the district. The 2009-2010 school year was discouraging to these community members. They felt that they had no voice. Their ideas to help went unnoticed with the district administration refusing to listen or meet with them.
The 2010-2011 school year has now begun and the predictions and calculations of the
naysayers have proven accurate. But this year there are unifying themes. The shock of having only nine, moving downward to five, in the upstart orchestra classroom at Nathan Hale; and the diminished freshman class at Roosevelt, has alarmed all. At a recent Goodloe-Johnson coffee conversation meeting at Eckstein Middle School parent representatives were able to dialogue with Goodloe-Johnson and Susan Enfield. Principals were also in attendance. Parents came prepared with a number of well thought
out plans to help the existing students and separate plans for the future. These plans focus on building music programs in all schools, spring-boarding off the success of the current programs. The parents felt they had an audience and an official meeting was scheduled and held. A plan has been created that should mitigate some of the problems this year within a short timeline, and a suggested promise for meetings about the future was taken into advisement. Principals seem to be trying to help. The Roosevelt freshman orchestra has gained a few underserved students as a result of the recent adjustments in student assignments. Educators, parents and students in established programs are finding ways to reach out to the new programs. The area’s professional music educators are meeting discussing long-term ideas. They seem encouraged by the prospects of stabilized feeder elementary schools that the new SAP brings, while very concerned about the health of the high school programs.
Obstacles that have been unearthed include but are not limited to: transportation,
official instructional time, teacher training and education, site based management verses district oversight, territorial protection, specific contractual restrictions, fear of upper administration, pride in an ideology placed above the well being of current students, fear of change and fear of failure. It is sad to realize how easily most of these problems could have been overcome if dealt with before the new SAP was implemented. Now we must work to change the barriers for success from hindsight.
The middle school teachers have a clear and realistic view of the situation. They are in a difficult emotional situation. They see great benefit from music education and see young lives transformed by being part of something as cooperative and cognitive as music. Yet to lead students into such a pursuit without a similar experience available in high school seems cruel. It is difficult to prove “ the chicken or the egg” . Students involved in school music programs have some of the highest test scores and success rates in other academic areas. Our Seattle Public Schools have produced some of the countries most outstanding school musical groups. Our community loves to site the awards and achievements of these groups as an affirmation of the success of our community as a whole.
Equity in such cognitive pursuits cannot be achieved by equal access to “educational materials” but may only be achieved by equal access to high achieving programs. Let us all set aside our pride and come together work for real solutions.
The new Student Assignment Plan (SAP) changes the demographics of who is assigned to which school. However, specialized programs are still in place at these same locations but now the students are distributed without regard to their interests or merit.
Parents, teachers and local administrators predicted the oncoming situation and how it
would affect a prized resource of music education. They predicted that existing programs would come dangerously close to not having enough participants to justify a full time professional educator (125 students). Calculations indicated that schools that thought they were going to have new programs would not receive a critical mass necessary to fill a classroom. Petitions were gathered and presented to the administration. Emails poured into the suggestion site. Meetings were attended. The school board was addressed. Individual meetings with board members were arranged and parents met regularly to discuss ways to be heard by the district. The 2009-2010 school year was discouraging to these community members. They felt that they had no voice. Their ideas to help went unnoticed with the district administration refusing to listen or meet with them.
The 2010-2011 school year has now begun and the predictions and calculations of the
naysayers have proven accurate. But this year there are unifying themes. The shock of having only nine, moving downward to five, in the upstart orchestra classroom at Nathan Hale; and the diminished freshman class at Roosevelt, has alarmed all. At a recent Goodloe-Johnson coffee conversation meeting at Eckstein Middle School parent representatives were able to dialogue with Goodloe-Johnson and Susan Enfield. Principals were also in attendance. Parents came prepared with a number of well thought
out plans to help the existing students and separate plans for the future. These plans focus on building music programs in all schools, spring-boarding off the success of the current programs. The parents felt they had an audience and an official meeting was scheduled and held. A plan has been created that should mitigate some of the problems this year within a short timeline, and a suggested promise for meetings about the future was taken into advisement. Principals seem to be trying to help. The Roosevelt freshman orchestra has gained a few underserved students as a result of the recent adjustments in student assignments. Educators, parents and students in established programs are finding ways to reach out to the new programs. The area’s professional music educators are meeting discussing long-term ideas. They seem encouraged by the prospects of stabilized feeder elementary schools that the new SAP brings, while very concerned about the health of the high school programs.
Obstacles that have been unearthed include but are not limited to: transportation,
official instructional time, teacher training and education, site based management verses district oversight, territorial protection, specific contractual restrictions, fear of upper administration, pride in an ideology placed above the well being of current students, fear of change and fear of failure. It is sad to realize how easily most of these problems could have been overcome if dealt with before the new SAP was implemented. Now we must work to change the barriers for success from hindsight.
The middle school teachers have a clear and realistic view of the situation. They are in a difficult emotional situation. They see great benefit from music education and see young lives transformed by being part of something as cooperative and cognitive as music. Yet to lead students into such a pursuit without a similar experience available in high school seems cruel. It is difficult to prove “ the chicken or the egg” . Students involved in school music programs have some of the highest test scores and success rates in other academic areas. Our Seattle Public Schools have produced some of the countries most outstanding school musical groups. Our community loves to site the awards and achievements of these groups as an affirmation of the success of our community as a whole.
Equity in such cognitive pursuits cannot be achieved by equal access to “educational materials” but may only be achieved by equal access to high achieving programs. Let us all set aside our pride and come together work for real solutions.
Comments
You can have a strings class, or offer private lessons, but you can not play symphony music with a dozen kids.
You also can not have a program with just one orchestra in a school. The kids who play together need to be similar in ability level. If they are going to learn anything, they need to be able to advance through more than one ability level.
To have an orchestra program takes a certain number of kids. The orchestra teachers all knew this & tried to work with the district to build a system that could be expanded to other schools as the number of kids increased. But it was not important to the district administration, who decided that if they funded a teacher, they could say there would be an orchestra at each school.
It didn't work. But I think the parents are deluded if they believe that the district administration cares about this.
They've done their best to stamp out excellence in math, language arts, & now science; why would they worry about excellence in music?
That I have a hard time believing. I'd have thought most high schools have only one orchestra, and that closer in size to a chamber orchestra than a symphony.
Helen Schinske
Hamilton 66 in three orchestras, I do not know if this includes any begining students
Washington 81 in two orchestras, I do not knonw if this includes any begining.
What needs to change? They need a well thought out plan for the future. Listing to the music educators and parents would be a great start.
The recent listening and response from Susan Ensfield has been encouraging. Bringing appropriatly skilled and empowered persons together to deal with this situation is what is needed. They have started here in the NE. I hope they will be encouraged to continue and expand.
Roosevelt has 3 orchestras
Eckstein has 4 orchestras
Hamilton has at least 3
Washington has at least 2
Helen Schinske
Might you have a minute to explain to this dense math teacher why there are 2 and 3 orchestras?
I'm scratching my head, and now I'm just curious.
Are the kids broken up by skill level ... ??? or ...???
thanks if you have a moment.
bob
"It is sad to realize how easily most of these problems could have been overcome if dealt with before the new SAP was implemented."
I played at in an excellent orchestra in middle school and high school. Our high school orchestra had at least 80 kids in 9th-12th grades. There was a wide range of abilities among the string players (the brass, winds & percussion were pulled from the first several chairs in the symphonic band).
Those who really excelled from the string sections (1st-6th chair, approximately) also played in a chamber orchestra. However, it was more of an additional challenge and met as an extra curricular activity.
What was absolutely critical to having a successful symphonic orchestra, however, was a critical mass of students to make up a full and robust orchestra. We had some players who had been playing since they were 4 or 5 (the Suzuki kids) and the rest of us who had started in 4th or 5th grade.
Those who started later (or didn't practice as much) just sat farther back in the section and worked to the best of their ability.
Hamilton has at least 3 bands (beginner, cadet, and advanced, as well as 2 after-school jazz bands. not sure if senior jazz band is different from advanced band, but whatever it is, they have it). They also have a choir. All of those, with the exception of the two after-school jazz bands, are classes held during the school day.
I'm not sure if they have orchestra on top of this, or if it is all the same thing. I know they are taking over one of the rooms built for PE because they have already outgrown their two month old space.
Pretty phenomenal growth for a school that just over a year ago had only after-school based programs (from what I'd heard). I think NSAP will ultimately offer provide more opportunities to more kids. W
Scheduling this stuff must be a nightmare. My son was not able to take band because his level (Cadet) met at the same time as the only 7th grade spectrum class.
I think they are mostly divided by skill level and membership in upper level orchestras is by audition. There is always variation in skill level in every orchestra, but too much variation limits the repertoire.
The students are expected to learn & improve their playing with each year of experience, though they may not move up to a new orchestra each year. These are classes, with credit, homework & grades. They are different from clubs.
Roosevelt also has 3 or 4 levels of Jazz bands.
Former Musician
So? Either the district commits the money up front, allows the small groups & tries to grow them over a few years. Or they don't.
Of course if there really is a desire to have an award winning orchestra in SPS, then maybe we should have a music magnet option school, open to all who want to attend.
Former Musician
Franklin for instance, has no strings program at all (unless something changed this year, which seems unlikely). That needs to be addressed as much as whether other schools have more than one full orchestra.
I don't think that SYSO for the most part is a subsitute for public school strings programs. My kid loves playing the violin, she is good but not stellar. I think of her participation in the same way I think of school sports - she isn't going to make the varsity girls soccer team. She is more of a non-cut sport kinda athlete. No cut cross country is just as valuable and enjoyable to kids as are the school music programs that serve all levels of musicians.
Greywatch - Orchestra and band are not the same thing. There are no strings in band.
Yes, Hamilton has four orchestra classes in addition to the band classes you mention. I believe three of them are strings only and then Symphonic Orchestra brings in winds, brass and percussion. Beginning orchestra is a place for kids who didn't start SPS music in 4th or 5th grade to start from the very beginning, and the other groups are based on level of ability.
Keith - can you please share what the proposals are?
Er, because it's not a feeble attempt at all? We have public school orchestras that get national recognition as well. Come hear them sometime.
My daughter, who plays viola, got into the top level orchestra at Garfield with essentially no private lessons (she has met with a private teacher a few times -- three, I think -- but never gotten going with regularly scheduled lessons). She did have private piano lessons a long time ago.
It's been vastly easier (and cheaper), in terms of schedule and so forth, for her to meet the demands of a first-class music program within the school than outside it. Naturally she would also benefit from private lessons (and certainly from practicing a more), and something like SYSO would be a great opportunity, but realistically she doesn't have the time.
The reason for the massive expansion in Hamilton music programs was the influx of APP students (though other students there have surely benefited). One promise the district did keep was to beef up the music program at Hamilton.
Helen Schinske
Several years ago,I observed a small Denny MS strings group that was every bit as polished as WMS. The teacher was clearly dedicated.
Helen Schinske
No one likes it when their program gets a little smaller, but from the perspective of a school with a small program, I'd love to see the orchestra and band students spread out a bit more, so that each school has a viable basic program. If, after that, some schools can layer on extra ones, terrific!
I personally am not advocating a particular solution and I believe that there are multiple solutions. For example, the middle and high school teachers are working hard to build larger programs from the elementary schools. An organized system has not been effective in the past because of the feeder pattern. Now they have an established feeder patter in which to work and build. Building from the elementary up will increase the likelihood of orchestras in every school.
Before the new SAP there were problems with access and now there are different problems with access. It seems the best role for me the parent is to be a catalyst for solutions and not pretend to be the expert. My children are lucky and are in quality orchestra programs in the Seattle Public Schools but there are others that are not so fortunate.
You mentioned that your group has good dialogue happening with some good administrators and good teachers working on this issue. Can you give us any more details? I'd really appreciate it!
Given the feeder patterns, Roosevelt should continue to have a good number of string students since Hamilton and Eckstein both partly feed into Roosevelt. The part of Eckstein that feeds into Hale seems to be lacking a viable program. Am I correct on this?
The tough thing about the district only funding teachers if there are enough interested students there already, is that if there is no program, families who really want that option will do whatever they can to go to a school that does have a program. So, only the few who aren't able to access another school via open choice seats will end up at a school with no established program. Catch-22.
I'd like to see something at each school - even if at some schools it is a very small chamber music program.
That's great that your daughter has the opportunity to be in a good orchestra. Notably though, viola is quite a bit easier than most other instruments. But the argument for a special rule in the NSAP doesn't hold water. She's never going to be a professional with that level of effort. So, why should the whole system be changed just to afford her a superior experience, while at the same time, ensuring that lots of others with a similar level of dedication don't get that? Or perhaps, ensuring that others get no orchestra at all? The idea that all students should basically be funneled into 1 or 2 good programs doesn't serve anyone well. The only good case for that would be that those are the only avenues to professional development. They aren't. Nor are they sufficient.
Former Musician
We need to maintain and grow the existing orchestras at Garfield and Roosevelt (and all of their levels, as the training orchestras are an integral part of what allows the "A" orchestras to excel in national competitions, etc.) At the same time, we need to start working aggressively to develop orchestras at all of the existing public high schools that do not have them.
String orchestras, brass ensembles, woodwind ensembles, etc. are nice, and are probably a step somewhere in the process, but part of what orchestras do is give the kids an opportunity to play the orchestral classics. If schools are limited to small ensembles, there are not opportunities to play much of Tschaikovsky, Mozart, Beethoven, Saint-Saens, Holst, Dvorak, Liszt, etc.
I think what is needed is a high level parent/educator group, covering middle and high schools, to figure out how to maximize the experience. Maybe during the years when we are growing full orchestras in schools, we can create full orchestra experiences if we combine smaller programs (e.g., Sealth/Franklin/RB -- students would work separately on pieces in their own schools, and then would combine for the final series of rehearsals and performances) until each school has enough musicians to stand alone. Perhaps the same could be done in the north end with Hale and Ingraham. Or maybe a small program (like Hale) could do some ensemble work, but could also combine, for some performances, with one of the Roosevelt orchestras, so they can play a wider range of music. If the issue is musical proficiency, perhaps the solution is to do the combined performances with different orchestra levels in the larger school (some Hale musicians would learn pieces to play with Roosevelt's B orchestra, some with the A orchestra, etc.).
Just like athletic kids, musical kids are everywhere in Seattle -- and all that is needed (besides conductors, practice time and space, parent support, etc.) to grow the programs are the opportunities for kids to play really great music.
How could anyone justify allowing only two neighborhood high schools to get all of the resources when only kids that live within those two schools boundaries have access to them? Meanwhile the unlucky musicians who happen to live in the Hale or Franklin boundaries get nothing, or an orchestra with 5 kids.
That is just wrong on so many levels.
There are indeed music programs at TOPS K-8: orchstra, sting quartet, several bands. Also choir. 4th thru 8th grade.
What? There is no special rule in the NSAP and I am not arguing for there to be one. Nor am I arguing for students or resources to be funneled into one or two good programs. I don't know how you got any of that from what I said.
Helen Schinske
Wait a minute. Garfield and Roosevelt may get marginally more money because of the size of their music program BUT those programs run mostly on booster money. The district doesn't give any music program a huge amount of money.
I had advocated for an audition rule for the NSAP because of the power of decades of excellence for Garfield and Roosevelt and how difficult it would be to duplicate for other high schools (at least for now). I also think there should have been something for the Biotech Academy at Ballard. But it didn't happen.
The district has now created a true magnet school in STEM at Cleveland. So it wouldn't seem to be weird to ask for some other kind magnet school like a music magnet. (I doubt it would happen but STEM is now an example.)
I like the fact that predictable feeder patterns can be developed. And that is made possible by the NSAP. You could even imagine a system where younger feeder students were allowed early access to the high school orchestra to fill out seats. Maybe they've got that now.
Former Musician
Besides, the jury's still out on the STEM magnet.
Former Musician
That said, I do know that being in the Garfield or Roosevelt music program (especially the upper level jazz and orchestra programs) can help you if you intend to apply for a university music program or scholarship. It can have advantages to live near a good program your child wants to be in. Maybe that is the difficult side of neighborhood assignments for everyone else.
I would like to add that many of your ideas are successfully used in other school districts. Almost all large cities have an arts high school. Other districts share resources (teachers) between schools. Others move students between schools. Some have one orchestra. Some have many. Some have an all star orchestra meeting outside of instructional time. Please refocus on the problem! The new status quo is not serving many students and we can do better than this. A list of barriers and excuses are in the article. These are real and significant. I hear a lot of suggestions about how programs can be structured differently but almost no suggestions on how to work with the people of our community to make a plan a reality. The article was intended to report on actual progress. That progress is a beginning. I did not imply which direction I prefer nor do I know where our NE district’s discussions are headed. I do know that they are addressing the under served now and promising to have discussions about the future. They have a list of suggestions that is inclusive of the many ideas that you are sharing. This is so much better than the posturing, rudeness and refusing to meet with organized parent groups of last year. What we need is momentum to keep working. Keep encouraging the administrations that we care about these programs and we appreciate the time and effort they are using in our particular area of concern.
Another interesting note is how Hamilton middle school suddenly emerged with intact music programs. Washington Middle school's APP program was divided and the northern students sent to Hamilton. That first year they had a vibrant music program. My numbers indicate a small overall increase in participation with the sum of the two schools programs. Could this be used to help some or all high schools.
I am however still muddy on the details of the work you and your group are doing, and how other interested folks might help. The general concepts sound good, but I don't know where to go to get the who, when, where details.
You said "...nor do I know where our NE district's discussions are headed. I do know that they are addressing the underserved now and promising to have discussions about the future. They have a list of suggestions that is inclusive of the many ideas you are sharing.....Keep encouraging the administrators, etc."
Keith, how can other NE parents get involved in the discussions that you mentioned? It would be wonderful to be able to access the work that has already been done in forming the list of suggestions that already exists. Can you refer me to a web-site? Do you have group meetings open to other parents?
I'm not at all "alarmed" by Hale's upstart orchestra with 9 students in it. Rather I applaud and support the school for taking the first steps in moving toward a stronger music program! And I expect that it will grow and thrive with a bit of support.
Keith believes "the new status quo isn't serving many students", but I believe the old status quo served far fewer students. Only those kids that were lucky enough to live within a two mile radius of Roosevelt or Garfield, or who were in APP, could take advantage of the great orchestras that those two schools had to offer. That hardly seems equitable. All of the other aspiring musicians across the district had small or non existent orchestras in their neighborhood high schools. Not a great model.
Eventually (and I know it will take some time) the NSAP will even the playing field. Until then I can't get behind any type of resolution that continues to funnel students into two schools with high level orchestras unless all students across the district have access to those two schools.
SPS parents have had to deal with these inequities for far to long. It's time to move forward now.
Please reconsider your judgment of my positions. My personal position is: The Seattle Public Schools do not have a well thought out plan to provide quality orchestra instruction. I have never advocated one particular orchestral arrangement. I have only advocated a well thought out plan and offered my own ideas and tried to share the ideas of others. I have worked and am working on improving this situation in all schools. My philosophy like yours is of equity for all. I did mention that the old system also did not work well. I am for change but I am also advocating for a well thought out plan involving quality instruction and shared resources. There seems to be many obstacles to overcome to achieve quality orchestra instruction and shared orchestra resources. Part of the NSAP involved encouraging parents participation in building programs after the plan was set in motion. I would have preferred plans be in place before implementing the NSAP. I am now participating in the building of programs as MGJ asked. I am also reporting on the activities of parents involved in the orchestra program at Eckstein Middle School, Roosevelt and Nathan Hale high schools. Loosely organized with no chosen leader, parents are trying their best to do what they can. The parents in these programs have offered their resources to other schools and are actively showing their good intentions. We are only parents with parent type resources doing what we feel as citizens is important. I ask for your encouragement. Enlighten those you have access to of the concern many have in this area. I can only imagine similar issues are frustrating other educational areas. Perhaps a process to solve this problem will be helpful in other areas.
• Music instruction from an early age. Many of the kids in the successful programs started some form of private music instruction well before 4th grade. Those that didn't had access from 4th grade on.
• Access to a decent-quality instrument. Loaner and rental instruments are notoriously inferior and can be very frustrating to a talented child—especially when they know they are playing the correct note, but it comes out wrong because of the quality of the instrument.
• Access to outside private lessons. Many of the G/R musicians take at least some lessons outside of school.
• Access to a place to practice and encouragement to do so. Let's face it—it's not fun listening to a novice string or clarinet player. Squeaks and blares can be annoying and possibly disturbing to a sleeping infant or a parent who works the night shift.
• A parent group that can fundraise for sheet music, transportation to and application fees for competitions, and "costumes" (have you priced a tuxedo shirt?) for those kids whose families can't just pony up $500-$1500.
And, just as in another thread where someone was talking about teacher quality in low-income schools, there are only so many fantastic orchestral music teachers around. Can Seattle really find 20-30 equitable teachers to spread around?
I applaud Keith and his group for working with the District, but it's going to take some parents who understand the issues faced by many of the schools with high FRL to come close to having equitable programs in all schools. What we really need is an instrumental music fairy to magically boost budgets and provide for those kids whose parents can't.
Helen Schinske
There are a couple of existing programs, such as Seattle Music Partners (http://www.seattlemusicpartners.org/) and Rotary Music4Life (http://www.rotarymusic4life.org/pgs/02-about.html). I think there's at least one other that I can't remember the name of, which focuses on less common instruments such as French horn.
Helen Schinske
1. Recruit professional musician volunteers to give lessons to children who cannot afford lessons. Perhaps people from Seattle Symphony, or retired UW music profs.
2. Contact the staff, faculty and students at UW and Cornish Music departments, ask for their involvement in helping the students in high poverty areas to have access to music program/training.
3. Ask for help from non-profits that have been working with FRL children and Title 1 schools, such as the Nature Consortium and Arts Corps.
4. There is an organization that provides free classical instruments to students from high FRL schools, I forgot what they are called, but I remember reading about their program on SPL Arts web page; someone with grant writing experience could apply for this for the schools.
5. Give talks at elementary schools and reach out to parents in other ways (newsletter, etc.) to stress the importance and benefits of music to their children's growth and development.
6. Create a peer mentoring program, where students who have been having lessons for many years can help the beginners, perhaps as part of their community service requirement.
I forgot to sign my post, so I'm reposting it since the unsigned post will probable get deleted
SPS mom
SPS parent