Talking to Your Child without a Parent Present
When I attended a DeBell community meeting a couple of months back, there were some very unhappy McClure parents. They had numerous issues but one was that two of their students had been pulled out of class - for different reasons relating to higher level behavior issues - and questioned by administrators. One of the fathers was upset that neither he nor his wife had been contacted about the questioning.
(By higher level behavior issues, I mean things like fighting, drugs found, etc.)
The father said something to the effect of "well, if it had been the police I would have been notified." That stuck with me and I finally got around to checking.
The policy in question that answers this issue is D78.00 School-Police Relations (it is to be reviewed as part of the on-going Board policy updates).
There is a section on "interviewing of students" which states that the district encourages any police questioning to take place "off school premises", "the principal shall permit a law enforcement officer to conduct any necessary questioning of students at school."
Also, "The officer shall advise and afford a student the same legal rights as an adult and the right to have a parent present during questioning if the student is twelve years of age or younger."
Kind of gray, no? I interpret that last sentence to mean the student has the right to remain silent and ask for his/her parents. However does that mean reading the Miranda rights? Will the principal and/or officer tell the child that he or she does NOT have to answer any questions until mom or dad gets there? And, under this policy, if the child is older than 12, he or she will be questioned.
When you were 13 if you were read the Miranda rights by a cop with your principal and/or counselor standing there, would you have known what to do? Sure, you could ask for mom or dad but that's not the same as saying "I won't answer questions without them." Police officers are very good at getting adults to talk, what about a kid?
I put this question into Google and happened to find a response from a Washington State attorney. He says:
Pulling a child out of a classroom for questioning certainly does not seem right, but it is perfectly legal and the child has no right to have a parent present. HOWEVER, instruct your child to tell the police that he either wants to talk to a lawyer before answering questions, or that he has been instructed by his lawyer not to answer any questions. The police must respect this response and not ask your child further questions.
Note, he says the child should say "lawyer", not parent.
If you have a middle or high school child, talk to them. Tell them that if ever something goes wrong and they are suddenly called into the office by the principal/counselor and/or police officer, they are to say "I can't answer any questions without my mom/dad/guardian here." That's their mantra.
Again, things happen. Someone could have stashed something in your child's backpack without your child knowing. Your child may be physically attacked and strikes out in self-defense. Whatever it is, let your child know to wait for you no matter what they get told by administrators or police.
There was also this odd bit in the policy under Emergency Situations:
a. In most circumstances, when a building principal needs to contact the police, the principal will initially contact the School Security office of SPS, which will in turn notify the police, if such action is warranted.
I'm thinking this is one part of the policy that needs rewriting. If it's an "emergency", then call the police FIRST. If you need police in order to arrest someone AFTER an incident, sure call School district security first
(By higher level behavior issues, I mean things like fighting, drugs found, etc.)
The father said something to the effect of "well, if it had been the police I would have been notified." That stuck with me and I finally got around to checking.
The policy in question that answers this issue is D78.00 School-Police Relations (it is to be reviewed as part of the on-going Board policy updates).
There is a section on "interviewing of students" which states that the district encourages any police questioning to take place "off school premises", "the principal shall permit a law enforcement officer to conduct any necessary questioning of students at school."
Also, "The officer shall advise and afford a student the same legal rights as an adult and the right to have a parent present during questioning if the student is twelve years of age or younger."
Kind of gray, no? I interpret that last sentence to mean the student has the right to remain silent and ask for his/her parents. However does that mean reading the Miranda rights? Will the principal and/or officer tell the child that he or she does NOT have to answer any questions until mom or dad gets there? And, under this policy, if the child is older than 12, he or she will be questioned.
When you were 13 if you were read the Miranda rights by a cop with your principal and/or counselor standing there, would you have known what to do? Sure, you could ask for mom or dad but that's not the same as saying "I won't answer questions without them." Police officers are very good at getting adults to talk, what about a kid?
I put this question into Google and happened to find a response from a Washington State attorney. He says:
Pulling a child out of a classroom for questioning certainly does not seem right, but it is perfectly legal and the child has no right to have a parent present. HOWEVER, instruct your child to tell the police that he either wants to talk to a lawyer before answering questions, or that he has been instructed by his lawyer not to answer any questions. The police must respect this response and not ask your child further questions.
Note, he says the child should say "lawyer", not parent.
If you have a middle or high school child, talk to them. Tell them that if ever something goes wrong and they are suddenly called into the office by the principal/counselor and/or police officer, they are to say "I can't answer any questions without my mom/dad/guardian here." That's their mantra.
Again, things happen. Someone could have stashed something in your child's backpack without your child knowing. Your child may be physically attacked and strikes out in self-defense. Whatever it is, let your child know to wait for you no matter what they get told by administrators or police.
There was also this odd bit in the policy under Emergency Situations:
a. In most circumstances, when a building principal needs to contact the police, the principal will initially contact the School Security office of SPS, which will in turn notify the police, if such action is warranted.
I'm thinking this is one part of the policy that needs rewriting. If it's an "emergency", then call the police FIRST. If you need police in order to arrest someone AFTER an incident, sure call School district security first
Comments
PD/parent
--FedMomof2
To question or discipline a child like mine without a parent present or informed, should never be allowed to happen. Some children are easily led, or have difficulty providing context in their communication.
-InformationIsPower
I mean 'high level' excuses.
Why are adult ideas on bullying ignored by school kids? because the
Bullies Are Coddled.
-perplexed
Setting aside the perplexiousity (new word!) of your statement, I find that you assume these 10% who are coddled are guilty of crimes and require police action. The entire point of Miranda rights and protecting the under-age is that our country values the maxim of innocent until proven guilty. But laws are only guidelines, right?
Mr Ed
-PS mom
"They had numerous issues but one was that two of their students had been pulled out of class - for different reasons relating to higher level behavior issues - and questioned by administrators. One of the fathers was upset that neither he nor his wife had been contacted about the questioning."
It didn't sound like this was about police questioning the student, but about the administrator questioning the student: What rights are there (or should there be) for students being questioned by administrators (or any adult in the building, for that matter)?
Discuss.
"They had numerous issues but one was that two of their students had been pulled out of class - for different reasons relating to higher level behavior issues - and questioned by administrators. One of the fathers was upset that neither he nor his wife had been contacted about the questioning."
It didn't sound like this was about police questioning the student, but about the administrator questioning the student: What rights are there (or should there be) for students being questioned by administrators (or any adult in the building, for that matter)?
Discuss.
He is wrong on both points and students can be questioned without parents being called (or called in a timely manner).
You should teach kids to respect authority but also that they have rights even as kids. There is nothing disrespectful about asking for your civil rights to be honored and to ask for a parent to be present if you are questioned.
Now, why are we cutting sani-wipes and pencils?
Schools are under mandate to report various things to various people, and as we saw in a recent situation, sometimes the clarity isn't there or people are unaware of their reporting responsibilities. On the flip side, educators (like regular ol' citizens, believe it or not) are human and might consider it unwise to bring in the police for, say, a playground fight, believing that to involve the police is over-kill, that schools are place to learn and teach and that they, the educators, can help resolve the issue on a more humane level, perhaps, than the full force of the legal system might.
Not saying that that is good, or to be encouraged, but that it raise (again: I think we had this discussion a couple of years back) the issue of what, exactly, SHOULD go on through to the police and what should be resolved, if possible, in-house.
Schools are under mandate to report various things to various people, and as we saw in a recent situation, sometimes the clarity isn't there or people are unaware of their reporting responsibilities. On the flip side, educators (like regular ol' citizens, believe it or not) are human and might consider it unwise to bring in the police for, say, a playground fight, believing that to involve the police is over-kill, that schools are place to learn and teach and that they, the educators, can help resolve the issue on a more humane level, perhaps, than the full force of the legal system might.
Not saying that that is good, or to be encouraged, but that it raise (again: I think we had this discussion a couple of years back) the issue of what, exactly, SHOULD go on through to the police and what should be resolved, if possible, in-house.
D78.00 that Melissa mentioned.
A new but related policy (and SP Procedure) 3230 "Student Privacy & Searches" deals with some of the situations Melissa brings up, of searches vs. student' rights.
Many times in schools I've heard of students being taken out of class for either locker searches and/or interviews by school administration, but parents are not notified. This is not a requirement in the new policy either, but isn't this a responsibility of the school to keep parents informed of these actions, and should be in the policy/procedure as well?
But this is an area where the "kids first" statement ends.
The district has a problem. They need information about an incident or they believe they know who caused it. You can more easily persuade/coerce/intimidate a student without a parent than with a parent. I have seen this myself.
No one is trying to be "unfair" but, like the police, they have a job to do.
And so do we as parents. Our job is to make sure our children are treated fairly, not pressured and before anyone admits any fault, that a thorough investigation is done. That means you have to protect your child because the school is not going to do so.
What are the student's rights and what is the school's responsibility to communicate with parents of an issue your kid is directly (or even indirectly) involved with? Should parents be informed when the school does searches for serious offenses such as drugs? I certainly would like to be informed, whether or not the search was justified (and kids may or may not want to tell their parents what happened).
Mirmac1- Some schools are rampant in their practice of pulling kids out of class (one count my kid told me was 23 kids pulled out of class for a heresay incident), and for trivial issues such as a stolen (or lost?) item which shouldn't have been taken to school in the first place, which happened off campus and after school. The school continued to pull kids out of class & interview them despite parents objecting about the loss of instructional time. Are there policies about this?
Perhaps more progressive districts have codified something along those lines...